17:30:01 <sysrqb> #startmeeting Tor Browser meeting 2019-09-30
17:30:01 <MeetBot> Meeting started Mon Sep 30 17:30:01 2019 UTC.  The chair is sysrqb. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
17:30:01 <MeetBot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
17:30:09 <sysrqb> Hello everyone!
17:30:12 <Jeremy_Rand_Talos> hello!
17:30:24 * sysrqb finishs add items on the pad
17:30:31 <brade> o/
17:30:32 <sysrqb> reminder: https://storm.torproject.org/shared/tHoN4Ii7rLSjPE0OP4gydX4cMGadsXmRQNc-6lwru0N
17:30:34 <pospeselr> \o
17:30:35 <mcs> hi
17:30:42 * tjr is caught up in something but will see a highlight
17:31:27 <boklm> hi
17:31:42 <sisbell> hi
17:31:53 <acat> hi
17:32:23 <antonela> hello!
17:34:01 <sysrqb> okay, let's start in about 2 minutes
17:34:19 <pospeselr> hiii
17:35:44 <sysrqb> okay
17:36:05 <sysrqb> welcome everyone for another week of tor browser development!
17:36:19 <sysrqb> antonela: i think you're first
17:36:34 <pili> hi :)
17:37:31 <antonela> hi folks, i've worked on some options for the new identity button we want to have at the toolbar
17:37:49 <antonela> feel free to leave your feedback at the ticket #27511
17:38:07 <GeKo> we should decide who will work on that item
17:38:15 <antonela> we don't have too much time so if it happens this week, double appreciated
17:38:15 <GeKo> it's not much time left
17:38:48 <GeKo> it should not be that hard, given it's essentially adding just a toolbar button
17:38:53 <GeKo> but still
17:39:14 <antonela> and, re : #31778 - i saw acat listed it for this week so, alex ping me if you need anything
17:39:57 <sysrqb> antonela: "- #a - Anything needed on my side for this?"
17:40:03 <sysrqb> should that be #31778?
17:40:22 <antonela> si, fixed
17:40:24 <acat> good, i can also work on #27511
17:40:27 <sysrqb> good :) thanks
17:40:42 <antonela> acat: thanks! ping me if anything
17:41:19 <sysrqb> okay, pili, i think you're next
17:41:23 <GeKo> do we have any winner if we look at anto's design options right now?
17:41:24 <sysrqb> about FOSDEM
17:41:43 <sysrqb> ah, we have some time, we can talk about that now
17:41:46 <GeKo> oh, we moved on, nvm then
17:41:50 <GeKo> heh
17:41:53 <sysrqb> https://trac.torproject.org/projects/tor/ticket/27511#comment:17
17:41:56 <GeKo> whatever
17:42:08 <GeKo> i think it might  be worth trying to settle on a candidate right now
17:42:11 <GeKo> while we are here
17:42:19 <GeKo> (if possible)
17:42:28 <antonela> that'd be useful, yes
17:42:37 <brade> I don’t like the first two (trash can and going back in time)
17:42:42 <pili> hi, sorry, i got a phonecall
17:42:45 <pili> here now
17:42:48 <sysrqb> yeah, that's a good idea
17:43:07 <sysrqb> np pili, we'll talk about antonela's question and then get to yours
17:43:13 <brade> I like the ID card but it’s hard to recognize with the vertical line in the middle
17:43:33 <pospeselr> of the options i like the cleaning brush icon
17:43:36 <Jeremy_Rand_Talos> yeah, the ID card isn't immediately recognizable as such to me
17:43:41 <pospeselr> though it might should be tweaked becasue it also looks like a bell
17:43:55 <Jeremy_Rand_Talos> the vertical lime makes it look like a squished apple to me
17:43:59 <Jeremy_Rand_Talos> line*
17:44:09 <pospeselr> yeah id card only really reads for me when you're zoomed in
17:44:19 <mcs> I like 3 best although the concept in 4 is good (hard to decipher the icon though, as others have said)
17:44:20 <pospeselr> which doesn't really work when it's little icon sized
17:44:23 <Jeremy_Rand_Talos> the cleaning brush / broom icon looks intuitive to me
17:45:10 <antonela> could it work if i iterate the brush/clean version?
17:45:19 <acat> i like delete (1st one)
17:45:34 <antonela> make it less look like a bell, and also refine the little size version
17:45:37 <Jeremy_Rand_Talos> the 2nd one looks too similar to a Refresh/Reload icon to me, though I may be an outlier on that opinion
17:45:50 <antonela> acat, i also like the trash as a concept
17:46:01 <brade> antonela: I’d rather you iterate on the ID.  Can you make it look more like a driver’s license (US-thinking??)
17:46:48 <antonela> brade, yes i could! i used that id because is the one that comes with https://design.firefox.com/icons/viewer/#
17:47:09 <antonela> ctrl+s+formfill
17:47:24 <boklm> the 3 and 1 look like the easiests to understand for me
17:47:53 <antonela> im quite happy that the 3 option got some fans
17:47:53 <sysrqb> antonela: did you decide against using a fire image?
17:47:56 <sysrqb> like ddg browser
17:48:00 <sysrqb> (i think)
17:48:11 <antonela> sysrqb: i didn't, maybe the trash do that work too
17:48:21 <antonela> i like the fire, tho
17:49:10 <brade> antonela: I don’t recognize that as “form fill” :-)
17:49:25 <antonela> me either :? so i took it as an ID icon lol
17:50:50 <antonela> this is a good feedback folks! thank you! if you have deeper ideas you can paste them in the ticket for the posterity. On my side will iterate based on what we just talked and back to the ticket asap
17:51:14 <sysrqb> thanks antonela
17:51:23 <antonela> once someone takes the ownership of that ticket, please let me know!
17:51:28 <antonela> thanks sysrqb
17:51:49 <sysrqb> any last comments on this?
17:52:02 <sysrqb> or odes anyone want to work on this?
17:52:05 <sysrqb> *does
17:52:15 <sysrqb> (while we're talking about it)
17:52:52 <acat> i can work on it (already said :) )
17:53:06 <antonela> :)
17:53:09 <sysrqb> oh, thanks acat :)
17:53:20 <antonela> good stuff acat, thanks
17:53:37 <acat> but will we have a decision on the icon this week?
17:53:43 <antonela> i hope so
17:54:10 <acat> ok!
17:54:34 <sysrqb> okay, pili
17:54:37 <pili> hi
17:55:08 <pili> just an announcement that I'm trying to put together a main track talk for fosdem and looking for potential speakers
17:55:29 <pili> also can do other non-main track talk
17:56:00 <pili> as it seems like there will be a decentralized internet and privacy devroom
17:56:11 <sysrqb> neat
17:56:56 <pili> that's it
17:56:59 <sysrqb> anyone have questions or comments about this?
17:57:21 <brade> (sorry; Internet out.)
17:57:37 <sysrqb> :(
17:58:12 <sysrqb> sisbell: how is #31564 going? can anyone help you with that?
17:58:19 <Jeremy_Rand_Talos> pili, I've considered going to FOSDEM but can't commit to attending at this time (mostly due to travel cost + lost dev time that it would entail)
17:58:38 <sysrqb> sisbell: i see your update, but i'm not sure what else we can do
17:58:46 <sisbell> sysrqb: At this point, I don't need any help. I just have to manually track every resource
17:58:50 <pili> Jeremy_Rand_Talos: yup, I understand, that's also why we're trying to send people from Europe from the Tor side also :)
17:59:17 <sisbell> I tried this a while ago and had missing resources so I'll need to track down where those are built
17:59:45 <sisbell> Its tedious but should make it repoducible
17:59:45 <Jeremy_Rand_Talos> pili, there are some European Namecoin devs, but they're less involved in the Tor-related dev aspects of Namecoin
18:00:02 <sysrqb> sisbell: we can likely get a slightly newer version of apktool in buster, if that will help
18:00:11 <sysrqb> (within the same major release)
18:00:49 <sisbell> That could also work. I'd test with the version prior to putting in buster so we can verify
18:01:23 <sisbell> When are we moving to buster?
18:01:26 <sysrqb> okay, we should ping _hc and ask about the newest version he can package
18:01:35 <sisbell> This could impact other platforms
18:01:47 <boklm> we move each platform separately
18:02:06 <boklm> so we could move android builds to buster now, if it's ready
18:02:32 <sisbell> boklm, ok so I'll need to make some changes to the configs since I removed stretch
18:02:55 <sisbell> I'll just add it for buster. I'll open a ticket if there isn't one already
18:03:18 <GeKo> sisbell: why not taking the appraoch you meantioned first to download some random apktool from the internet?
18:03:53 <sisbell> Depends on when we need the issue
18:04:04 <sisbell> That's the shortest path
18:04:16 <GeKo> comment:26 that is
18:04:21 <GeKo> well, last week :)
18:04:51 <GeKo> we've tried a lot so far and have just one alpha left which is due in about two weeks or so
18:05:04 <GeKo> i think it might be worth implementing the shortest path now
18:05:05 <sisbell> If everyone is ok with that, I can get that out today.
18:05:12 <GeKo> and then build on top of that
18:05:19 <GeKo> like getting _hc involved
18:05:28 <GeKo> and then move to buster
18:05:47 <sisbell> Yeah that works, we just need to version that we are pulling from remote repo put into buster
18:06:06 <GeKo> ?
18:06:21 <sisbell> So we can take baby steps, first download ourselves, then have that version included in buster
18:06:22 <GeKo> comment:26 did not seem to involve moving to buster
18:06:28 <GeKo> ah, yes
18:06:31 <GeKo> exactly
18:06:40 <GeKo> because other work is still blocked on that
18:06:47 <sysrqb> i don't know if we can get the same versoin in buster
18:06:49 <GeKo> like the gradle dependencies fix up
18:07:05 <sysrqb> i assume as long as the version in buster is new enough, that shoudl work
18:07:10 <GeKo> which in turn blocks getting other tickets out of our (review) queue
18:09:03 <sysrqb> okay, we'll look for that branch (early) this week, for reviewing
18:09:36 <sysrqb> anything else for weekly updates?
18:09:43 <GeKo> sisbell: please address boklm's feedback and push a new branch
18:09:50 <GeKo> rebased against master
18:10:06 <sisbell> yes, I see his comment, so I'll make that change
18:11:42 <sysrqb> okay, next up are discussion points
18:12:08 <sysrqb> the only one this week is discussing some questions about migrating desktop to rapid release
18:12:56 <sysrqb> these questions are coming from the OTF "pre-proposal" we submitted
18:13:01 <sysrqb> (i forget what it was called)
18:13:22 <GeKo> concept note?
18:13:23 <sysrqb> we're thinking about having a meeting later this week to go over the questions and decide on some answers
18:13:39 <sysrqb> ah, that could be it
18:13:55 <antonela> scope of work? :)
18:14:01 <sysrqb> how does Thursday look for people?
18:14:04 <sysrqb> :)
18:14:29 <sysrqb> does after 1700 UTC work for most people?
18:14:46 <sysrqb> or 1500-1600?
18:14:58 <sysrqb> pospeselr: sisbell what's the earliest you'd be comfortable with meeting?
18:15:36 <pospeselr> I can do 1500 UTC
18:15:39 <sisbell> I'm ok anytime
18:15:47 <sisbell> whatever works best for others
18:16:14 <pospeselr> or even 1400
18:16:36 <pospeselr> I'm CST at the moment
18:17:24 <pili> 15UTC is best for me
18:17:31 <sysrqb> okay, how's 1500 for everyone?
18:17:32 <pili> I have other meetings before and after
18:17:43 <boklm> 1500 works for me
18:17:43 <GeKo> wfm
18:17:44 <pospeselr> works for me
18:17:45 <brade> works for me and mcs
18:17:52 <pospeselr> Thursday right?
18:17:57 <sysrqb> yes
18:18:20 <sysrqb> acat: ^
18:18:29 <acat> works for me too
18:19:01 <sysrqb> okay, it sounds like we have a meeting
18:19:17 <sysrqb> oh, mcs brade ^
18:19:27 <sysrqb> oh, you did say!
18:19:28 <sysrqb> sorry
18:19:47 <sysrqb> okay, anything else we should discuss this week?
18:19:53 <_hc> hello
18:20:05 <GeKo> o/
18:20:06 <sysrqb> _hc: hey
18:20:06 <Jeremy_Rand_Talos> some Namecoin stuff on my end if you're interested
18:20:10 <_hc> reading the backlog
18:20:39 <sysrqb> Jeremy_Rand_Talos: sure, if you have a quick summary
18:21:24 <Jeremy_Rand_Talos> sysrqb, yeah, so the tl;dr is that I've been doing a bunch of refactoring/optimization work, as well as getting stream isolation to work properly.
18:21:38 <_hc> a backport of apktool 2.4.0 to buster should be easy
18:22:15 <Jeremy_Rand_Talos> Hoping to have a tor-browser-build patch that'll be in a reviewable state within a month, maybe sooner if things go well
18:22:49 <Jeremy_Rand_Talos> full list of things I've been doing in the last week is in the Etherpad for those who are curious
18:23:46 <sysrqb> neat
18:24:37 <sysrqb> thanks for the update
18:24:44 <Jeremy_Rand_Talos> no problem
18:24:57 <sysrqb> _hc: thanks. i don't know what version we'll need.
18:25:23 <sysrqb> _hc: hopefully sisbell can figure that out
18:25:28 <_hc> 2.4.0 is the latest release, you need something from git?
18:25:29 <boklm> it looks like 2.4.0 is the version we need according to the patch from https://trac.torproject.org/projects/tor/ticket/31564#comment:26
18:25:39 <sysrqb> _hc: ah!
18:25:52 <sisbell> yes that's the one
18:26:03 <sysrqb> okay, great
18:26:40 <sysrqb> okay, we can discuss the details for this after the meeting
18:26:44 <sysrqb> _hc: thanks
18:26:53 <_hc> you could probably just include the testing package directly in buster
18:27:10 <_hc> if you're not already using buster-backpots
18:27:32 <_hc> ok, let me know
18:27:43 <sysrqb> it's in -backports?
18:28:02 <_hc> I can upload it there
18:28:07 <sysrqb> ah, okay, yeah
18:28:15 <boklm> sisbell: which package did you use in https://trac.torproject.org/projects/tor/ticket/31564#comment:44 ?
18:28:17 <sysrqb> we can figure this out
18:28:58 <sysrqb> okay, i think we're done with the meeting
18:29:03 <sysrqb> thanks everyone!
18:29:16 <sisbell> bolkm: That was using the apktool pakcaged with buster
18:29:22 <Jeremy_Rand_Talos> thanks
18:29:29 <GeKo> o/
18:29:31 <sisbell> Its said 2.4.0 but the dependencies didn't match
18:29:31 <sysrqb> #endmeeting