14:01:24 <emmapeel> #startmeeting Community team meeting
14:01:24 <MeetBot> Meeting started Mon Mar  7 14:01:24 2022 UTC.  The chair is emmapeel. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
14:01:24 <MeetBot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
14:01:32 <championquizzer> thanks, emmapeel
14:01:47 <emmapeel> hello people, bear with me, ggus is afk this week and i will chair
14:01:55 <championquizzer> the pad is here: https://pad.riseup.net/p/tor-community-team-2022-keep
14:01:58 <rhatto> o/
14:02:11 <championquizzer> please update the pad with your updates for the week ^
14:02:13 <emmapeel> welcome to the community team meeting, please add your updates to the pad, and when you are ready we can start
14:02:19 <emmapeel> yes, exactly, thanks championquizzer
14:02:33 <emmapeel> we are also lacking on discussion topics for this week, so feel free to add!
14:07:03 <emmapeel> ok, are we ready?
14:07:27 <raya[m]> ready :)
14:07:42 <championquizzer> yes!
14:08:05 <nina13[m]> done!
14:08:21 <emmapeel> ey, lets move some stuff to the discussions, do you want to discuss more stuff?
14:08:48 <emmapeel> i will start with an announcement, that on Wednesday i will explain how the localization process works in Tor Project
14:08:57 <emmapeel> at the All-Hands
14:09:22 <championquizzer> looking forward to it
14:09:31 <raya[m]> yes looking forward to it!
14:09:38 <emmapeel> do you have any announcements, or updates that you would like to share?
14:10:44 <emmapeel> raya[m]: can you explain the problem with  https://forum.torproject.net/t/probleme-avec-le-proxy/1542/9 ? championquizzer is the forum expert here but others may be able to help
14:11:08 <raya[m]> yes of course, so this user is facing an issue connecting to Tor via the Android browser
14:12:19 <championquizzer> great idea to ask about the screenshot, raya[m]!
14:12:46 <raya[m]> thank you! I was confused at first what their error was
14:13:09 <raya[m]> I tried advising following what's written here:
14:13:09 <raya[m]> https://support.torproject.org/it/connecting/connecting-4/
14:13:37 <raya[m]> sorry English link: https://support.torproject.org/connecting/connecting-4/
14:14:02 <raya[m]> I guess I'm wondering how to guide them to change the port they're connecting with
14:14:15 <raya[m]> Would it be through TBA settings, or OS settings?
14:14:58 <championquizzer> i (still) think it's likely the issue when you launch urls into TBA from other apps
14:15:19 <championquizzer> the thing is Tor doesn't bootstrap on it's own
14:15:31 <emmapeel> for me, many times i need to close tor browser and connect again
14:15:34 <emmapeel> yeah exactly
14:15:44 <championquizzer> also note: the user doesn;t have the 'onion' icon on the status bar
14:16:06 <raya[m]> I asked them to check about that but didn't get a reply from them, will ask again!
14:16:21 <championquizzer> so...they will probably need to have Tor bootstrapped
14:16:35 <championquizzer> and the app minimized before launching links into the browser
14:16:47 <championquizzer> thanks, raya[m] ..i will also follow up on that one :)
14:17:40 <raya[m]> will reply to them now asking them to close the browser, open it, connect to the network, then try to access the site. will also tell them to lookout for the onion icon on the status bar
14:17:52 <raya[m]> thanks everyone and thanks championquizzer :)
14:18:28 <emmapeel> the thing is that after a while not browsing, the tor connection stops, but the browser stays 'open'. andthe link fails
14:18:34 <championquizzer> yep
14:18:54 <championquizzer> recent version of android are pretty aggressive with apps running in the background
14:19:12 <championquizzer> s/version/versions
14:19:27 <emmapeel> hehe ... 'green computing!'
14:19:59 <emmapeel> ok, any more updates?
14:20:09 <emmapeel> ey rhatto, what is OnionGroove? nice name!
14:20:34 <emmapeel> what is it for?
14:21:18 <rhatto> emmapeel, glad you liked the name heh :)
14:21:52 <rhatto> im working in a specification for a tool to ease onion services deployment, monitoring and management
14:22:06 <championquizzer> oh nice!
14:22:40 <emmapeel> more onions por favor!
14:22:44 <rhatto> its intended initially for the sponsor 123 project, but we considered that would be nice to make a generic tool instead of keeping customized code
14:23:47 <emmapeel> rhatto: cool! it will make for example ssl easily configurable?
14:24:05 <emmapeel> or onion-location?
14:25:30 <rhatto> emmapeel, yes, the idea is to simplify the setup... right now its relativelly easy to setup an .onion, but if you want to make it with high availability and other goodies its a bit harder and involves lots of steps and different applications, like onionbalance, the vanguards addon, manually getting a TLS certificate... not to say about setting up monitoring
14:25:54 <rhatto> im now editing the initial brainstorming here: https://gitlab.torproject.org/rhatto/oniongroove/-/blob/feature/specs/docs/specs.md
14:26:28 <rhatto> and here is the proposed partial topology: https://gitlab.torproject.org/rhatto/oniongroove/-/blob/feature/specs/docs/specs.md#topology
14:27:09 <rhatto> despite all internal complexity, the idea is to pack everything in a single tool with a clean configuration format
14:28:13 * championquizzer likes the oniongroove avatar too! :)
14:28:17 <emmapeel> rhatto: is looking great, thanks for sharing!
14:28:42 <emmapeel> hahahaha the avatar is great
14:28:53 <raya[m]> it's super cool :)
14:29:48 <emmapeel> ok, people, do not be shy, lets do some announcements
14:30:01 <rhatto> i hope to finish the initial specs ASAP and submit it to the community for evaluation / get feedback so we have a quick iteration
14:30:26 <rhatto> emmapeel, i like the avatar too! it's part of the concept :)
14:30:53 <rhatto> just ping me if you have questions/suggestions/references/etc about oniongroove and .onions in general :)
14:31:40 <emmapeel> #info ping rhatto if you have questions/suggestions/references/etc about oniongroove and .onions in general :)
14:31:54 <emmapeel> i hope that works...
14:33:15 <raya[m]> i have a question actually, what's the possibility of creating short links for .onion urls? maybe to make them memorable. this was a question asked in the mailing list and i got curious about it!
14:34:16 <rhatto> raya[m], thats an important question and its about thats getting more and more attention recently
14:34:36 <emmapeel> raya[m]: i dont know if the services that shorten URLs allow .onion tlds. but i think many people that runs .onions do not want them indexed, and if you use a URL shortener, you are letting the shortening service know about each of your visits...
14:35:21 <rhatto> raya[m], if I understood correctly your question, those short links are called Onion Names - https://securedrop.org/news/introducing-onion-names-securedrop/
14:35:47 <emmapeel> ah ok, that looks better
14:35:59 <raya[m]> ah yes!
14:36:20 <raya[m]> that's pretty cool :)
14:39:03 <rhatto> yes, currently this is implemented via rulesets at the tor browser, so while someone is browsing something.securedrop.tor.onion its the actual long .onion address thats being accessed
14:39:58 <rhatto> theres and ongoing effort to integrate this directly at the tor browser since the web extension (HTTPS-Everywhere) is about to be deprecated - https://gitlab.torproject.org/tpo/applications/tor-browser/-/issues/40458
14:40:37 <raya[m]> https-e deprecated :O that's news!
14:41:10 <raya[m]> oh it's native in browsers now
14:41:15 <raya[m]> reading about it :)
14:41:58 <championquizzer> https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2021/09/https-actually-everywhere
14:42:16 <rhatto> i believe that enhance the Onion Names feature (using rulesets of some other mechanism) + make TLS certs generation for .onions easier are two of the most important things to discuss around onion services right now
14:43:30 <emmapeel> aha
14:43:46 <emmapeel> yeah, who else apart of securedrop has them?
14:44:23 <emmapeel> and who is in charge of reviewing / verifying the names ?
14:44:33 <emmapeel> we should document this better on our side
14:45:21 <emmapeel> i.e. how you can get an Onion Name for your onion service
14:46:10 <rhatto> emmapeel, i agree about the docs
14:46:26 <raya[m]> I think for SecureDrop it's Freedom of the Press that's in charge of them
14:46:50 <rhatto> right now i believe that only secure drop is maintaining those rules and that it arrived as an experimental feature / partnership
14:47:16 <rhatto> at the same time, i dont know if right now its worth documenting that since the workflow might change soon
14:47:31 <emmapeel> yes, and that documentation explain how to get a subdomain <yourname>.securedrop.tor.onion  if you have a secure drop onion.
14:47:57 <emmapeel> but it does not tell how to get bbc.tor.onion or *.emmapeel.tor.onion
14:48:02 <rhatto> perhaps we should wait till this feature settles and is intended to be widespread before attempting to write some docs about "how to get my short onion name"
14:48:12 <emmapeel> i see
14:49:21 <rhatto> the big question right now is how to identify/attest that .emmapeel.tor.onion actually belongs to emmapeel, a problem similar to how certificate authorities handle TLS certs
14:50:32 <emmapeel> yeah
14:51:27 <emmapeel> ok, we have 9 minutes and then another meeting happens here.
14:51:56 <rhatto> wow time is mercyless :/
14:52:14 <emmapeel> rhatto: luckily we have the other channels to keep talking!
14:52:24 * gman999 is sorry.. but in another $work meeting
14:52:32 <emmapeel> but we would not want the meetbot to work too much, poor bot
14:52:55 <championquizzer> rhatto: thanks for the updates! very helpful
14:53:00 <emmapeel> is such a poor bot, it doesn't have SSL!
14:53:35 <rhatto> championquizzer, :)
14:54:39 <emmapeel> ok, lets start wrapping up then. any more comments, about onion-names, or something else?
14:55:10 <raya[m]> all clear :) thank you rhatto, this clears out a lot of fog
14:56:44 <emmapeel> ok, i would like to finish with a big hug to all the women everywhere for the International Day of Women!
14:57:42 <nina13[m]> Thank you, emmapeel Hugs!
14:57:42 <raya[m]> <3
14:57:52 <raya[m]> big hugs!
14:58:26 <championquizzer> thanks all <3 ..have a great week!
14:58:32 <emmapeel> #endmeeting