12:01:23 <werdahias> #startmeeting
12:01:23 <MeetBot> Meeting started Sat Aug 16 12:01:23 2025 UTC.  The chair is werdahias. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
12:01:23 <MeetBot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
12:01:37 <werdahias> #topic rollcall
12:01:49 <werdahias> please indicate you're here
12:01:58 <bastif[mds]> .
12:02:56 <AlexisOpolka[mds]> Hi, I'll also be observing since my planning for today changed quite a bit.
12:03:58 <federico3> hello there
12:05:48 <werdahias> ok ;)
12:06:13 <werdahias> #topic toolchain updates
12:06:40 <werdahias> nothing much to report here; we are on rustc 1.86 thanks to f_g
12:07:00 <werdahias> also we have a new debcargo allowing architecture override
12:07:13 <werdahias> for packages
12:07:25 <werdahias> #topic transitions
12:08:16 <werdahias> I have planned /staged the following: which 6->8, zerocopy / hashbrown, gtk-rs and notify
12:09:02 <werdahias> zerocopy needs a semver package in NEW; gtk-rs will also need to wait, same as notify
12:09:02 <bastif[mds]> started i18n-embed-fl.
12:09:38 <bastif[mds]> now in experimental for trial by jonas for sdml
12:09:53 <bastif[mds]> (includes update of  fluent)
12:10:34 <werdahias> noisycoil[mds]: which one do you have planned ?
12:11:53 <werdahias> please add anything you are planning to ##120
12:11:55 <noisycoil[mds]> I'm planning bindgen first
12:12:00 <werdahias> eh ##130
12:12:19 <noisycoil[mds]> And rustic after
12:12:32 <werdahias> time /9
12:12:37 <noisycoil[mds]> Rustix
12:12:44 <werdahias> right
12:13:14 <werdahias> if the time allows it for me I'd like to go ahead with which
12:13:39 <noisycoil[mds]> Yep, looking forward to it
12:14:11 <werdahias> zerocopy will have to wait until hashbrown 0.14 is ready
12:14:20 <werdahias> s/ready/accepted
12:14:30 <werdahias> I'd like to point out rand
12:14:42 <noisycoil[mds]> Have we already started it though?
12:14:57 <werdahias> it's used pretty much anywhere, and has a hug rdep tree
12:14:57 <noisycoil[mds]> Zerocopy I mean
12:15:04 <werdahias> noisycoil[mds]: no
12:15:22 <noisycoil[mds]> OK I thought I saw some packages already uploaded
12:15:33 <werdahias> well, staged in exp, but not uploaded
12:15:35 <noisycoil[mds]> Nevermind
12:15:45 <noisycoil[mds]> Ack
12:16:09 <noisycoil[mds]> Maybe we can ping ftpmasters for hashbrown
12:16:20 <werdahias> already did
12:16:25 <werdahias> #121
12:16:30 <werdahias> ##121
12:16:36 <noisycoil[mds]> Nice, thanks!
12:16:58 <werdahias> I would like some help there; as this is really huge
12:17:14 <noisycoil[mds]> How many packages?
12:17:21 <werdahias> the base rand crates are in exp already
12:17:28 <werdahias> noisycoil[mds]: 100+
12:17:35 <noisycoil[mds]> Oof
12:17:40 <noisycoil[mds]> Right
12:18:02 <noisycoil[mds]> Can we leave this for after rustix?
12:18:11 <werdahias> sure :)
12:18:12 <noisycoil[mds]> And maybe gtk?
12:18:23 <noisycoil[mds]> I think that's a large one too?
12:18:37 <werdahias> makes sense, yeah
12:18:55 <werdahias> though gtk will have to wait until after 13.1
12:18:59 <noisycoil[mds]> Also I'm pretty sure rand requires actual patching
12:19:14 <werdahias> it's mostly selfcontained though
12:19:16 <noisycoil[mds]> Not just semver bumping
12:19:35 <werdahias> yeah, they changed a bit of API
12:19:44 <noisycoil[mds]> Yep
12:20:21 <werdahias> I would propose a wip-rand brach where updates can be committed
12:21:18 <noisycoil[mds]> Agreed, so we can collaborate
12:21:46 <noisycoil[mds]> I don't think I can commit to (another) such large transition, but I can certainly help
12:21:59 <werdahias> yeah me neither
12:22:08 <werdahias> that's why I asked for help
12:22:35 <noisycoil[mds]> Nice let's do that then
12:22:43 <werdahias> anything else to add for the transitions topic?
12:23:55 <noisycoil[mds]> I think plugwash had a couple others but he's not there, so
12:24:03 <AlexisOpolka[mds]> If I happen to have time to learn how to package for debian, I could help.
12:24:10 <noisycoil[mds]> s/there/here/
12:24:12 <AlexisOpolka[mds]> But I can't promise anything rn
12:24:15 <noisycoil[mds]> At least afaics
12:24:23 <werdahias> noisycoil[mds]: they opened some issues in dcc
12:24:49 <noisycoil[mds]> Yep I saw that
12:25:01 <noisycoil[mds]> We'll coordinate later
12:25:42 <werdahias> I uploaded mostly small crate updates or selfcontained transitions like logos
12:26:03 <werdahias> ok, I'd move to AOB then unless someone objects ?
12:26:20 <bastif[mds]> what is AOB?
12:26:31 <noisycoil[mds]> Yep
12:26:40 <AlexisOpolka[mds]> I don't know either
12:27:07 <LeChatP[mds]> aob -> any other business If i'm not wrong
12:27:12 <werdahias> any other business
12:27:15 <werdahias> yeah
12:27:20 <AlexisOpolka[mds]> Ohh
12:27:26 <AlexisOpolka[mds]> It makes sense thx
12:27:37 <werdahias> #topic AOB
12:28:20 <federico3> are the team meetings going to be scheduled at the same time every 2 weeks?
12:28:33 <werdahias> federico3: no.
12:28:50 <werdahias> well, if someone organizes them, sure
12:29:01 <noisycoil[mds]> I see no benefit in having teem meeting every 2 weeks
12:29:02 <ncts[m]> I have a draft calling for the first editor meeting for quite a few months, so
12:29:23 <werdahias> We agreed on bimonthly iirc and that's what I strived to do
12:29:38 <bastif[mds]> What about modifying the version string for uploads to experimental so that in unstable we have "-1" instead of "-2" when a crate went through exp?
12:29:54 <werdahias> ncts[m]: annouce it on the ML ;)
12:30:00 <AlexisOpolka[mds]> I thought it was monthly but I'm okay with bimonthly too
12:30:27 <federico3> ah bimonthly as in every 2 months, ok
12:32:12 <werdahias> https://lists.debian.org/debian-rust/2025/01/msg00003.html
12:32:20 <noisycoil[mds]> irc_bastif[mds]: I saw your MR. I'm not entirely sure I agree. While I kinda like the exp suffix, many don't use it, and since you introduced a new environment variable to manage that I think it may ultimately slow down the workflow for little gain
12:32:36 <werdahias> 2 months back when we discussed it
12:32:44 <noisycoil[mds]> But if there's a clear preference from the team to add it I'm ok with that and I'll use it
12:33:00 <noisycoil[mds]> So mine is not in any way a nack
12:33:03 <werdahias> I don't use ~exp either tbh
12:33:26 <werdahias> If the majority agrees, sure, why not
12:34:15 <bastif[mds]> How would that slow down the workflow? You mean the script?
12:34:32 <noisycoil[mds]> Because you need to remember to add an extra environment variable
12:34:51 <noisycoil[mds]> Not a big deal, I recognize
12:34:57 <noisycoil[mds]> But still something
12:35:00 <bastif[mds]> If there was no need for a variable would it be better?
12:35:16 <noisycoil[mds]> Absolutely, but it would still require consensus
12:35:46 <noisycoil[mds]> You may perhaps open a thread on the mailing list and see what feedback you receive
12:35:53 <werdahias> agreed
12:35:55 <bastif[mds]> I was also wondering, how do you just bump the deb version, without updatin the latest upstream version?
12:36:12 <werdahias> REALVER=somever ./update.sh
12:36:29 <bastif[mds]> but that will add version suffix to package name, no?
12:36:48 <noisycoil[mds]> Nono, it won't
12:37:14 <werdahias> no, if somever is the current version (e.g. 0.9) then it will just increase the revision
12:37:43 <bastif[mds]> Ok. I'll have to remember that one
12:38:11 <LeChatP[mds]> ./repackage.sh does that too if i'm not wrong ?
12:38:41 <werdahias> LeChatP[mds]: that just creates the files in build/
12:38:47 <bastif[mds]> I think it doesn't update any version, or I'm misusing it
12:38:52 <noisycoil[mds]> And does not bump the debian revision
12:38:54 <werdahias> it does not up the revision
12:39:06 <werdahias> ok ;)
12:39:25 <werdahias> anything else to add for AOB ?
12:39:55 <bastif[mds]> Yes. How do we deal with security issues reported on trixie?
12:40:05 <bastif[mds]> or updates for 13.x
12:40:20 <noisycoil[mds]> We talked this a bit with f_g a few days ago
12:40:31 <bastif[mds]> I already mentioned that point here, but it seems not fully decided
12:40:31 <werdahias> for the former f_g wrote a mail to the release team
12:41:14 <werdahias> for 13.x updates: small, targeted fixes might work, but we'd also need to ask the release team
12:41:18 <noisycoil[mds]> I think his stance is sensible in that regards: both security and stable updates assume fixes are small and directed. As such they can be dealt with by simply re-uploading the source package
12:41:30 <bastif[mds]> We'd have to wait for their reply then, IIUC
12:41:37 <werdahias> yeah
12:41:50 <noisycoil[mds]> Still, I would like to have them committed in git
12:41:58 <werdahias> agreed
12:42:17 <bastif[mds]> In a specific branch I guess?
12:42:21 <noisycoil[mds]> And for that we need the tooling, which we don't have
12:43:09 <noisycoil[mds]> There's an open MR of mine dealing with the initial bits in that direction (namely, teaching the tooling how to deal with different branches), but it was not reviewed yet AFAIK and there's an open thread on the mailing list
12:43:23 <federico3> (speaking of which, I'm restarting some work on https://salsa.debian.org/rust-team/debcargo-conf/-/commits/dabs/?ref_type=heads )
12:43:40 <bastif[mds]> Oh, by tooling you mean the scripts? I though you meant debcargo
12:44:10 <noisycoil[mds]> No debcargo should mostly be fine
12:44:15 <noisycoil[mds]> Yes I meant the scripts
12:44:23 <bastif[mds]> ok!
12:44:28 <noisycoil[mds]> federico3 (IRC): Very nice! Looking forward to it
12:44:54 <federico3> <3
12:45:15 <noisycoil[mds]> Ah and f_g mentioned debcargo needs compat levels to deal with old format
12:45:31 <noisycoil[mds]> So in the end debcargo too will need some tweaking probably
12:46:11 <LeChatP[mds]> I'm packaging RootAsRole. It’s roughly my 26th to 28th new package. It's a never ending loop with always some new weird dev things. I'm contacting them for each exception I do when packaging. For now I don't update any crate, just repackage and relax or upgrade packages.
12:46:22 <LeChatP[mds]> It was a bit tricky to start the process
12:46:59 <noisycoil[mds]> Eh I know =S
12:47:19 <werdahias> personally, I tend to ignore -dev deps
12:47:44 <werdahias> ok, anything for AOB that should be discussed ?
12:47:46 <bastif[mds]> But that would lead to failing autopkgtests, no?
12:47:57 <werdahias> bastif[mds]: not necessarily
12:48:30 <bastif[mds]> do you have an example?
12:48:32 <werdahias> if you grep where the dependency is used it's sometimes just in benches/examples
12:48:38 <bastif[mds]> ok
12:50:15 <werdahias> https://salsa.debian.org/rust-team/debcargo-conf/-/commit/e84aa9e5bfdb5d305012f22cd08ba89bb5fda225
12:50:19 <werdahias> basically that
12:50:34 <werdahias> ok, going to next meet then
12:50:41 <werdahias> #topic next-meet
12:51:06 <bastif[mds]> ok, thanks
12:51:22 <werdahias> I would suggest 16th october then; maybe a bit earlier so people from other TZ can attend
12:52:39 <werdahias> will ask on the ML again, so we can discuss
12:53:25 <werdahias> ok, would like to end the meet then unless someone has to add anything ?
12:54:34 <werdahias> #endmeeting