20:00:17 <darst> #startmeeting
20:00:17 <MeetBot> Meeting started Tue Mar 29 20:00:17 2011 UTC.  The chair is darst. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
20:00:17 <MeetBot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
20:00:25 <darst> hi everyone
20:00:40 <darst> http://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf11/Meetings#Global_Team_Meeting.2C_29_March_20:00_UTC is the meeting agenda
20:00:47 <darst> if you are here, please say hi
20:00:47 <aroundthfur> hi
20:00:55 * AbsintheSyringe *waves
20:00:56 <vanja> hi
20:01:00 <jaqm> hi!
20:01:22 * karora looks up and waves to the crowd.
20:01:39 <leogg> hi!
20:01:44 <Clint> hi
20:02:19 <darst> anyone else?...
20:02:24 <vedran_omeragic> hi
20:02:39 * marga here
20:02:48 <vedran_omeragic> guys, i'm sick, and have some company atm
20:03:06 <vedran_omeragic> but i'll be here
20:03:08 <tassia> hi
20:03:39 * aroundthfur taps vedran_omeragic on the head
20:04:16 <darst> #topic DC10 Final report status
20:04:27 <darst> #info done, thanks to tiago and tassia, but...
20:04:47 <darst> #info We are waitingon DC9 surplus information to add the last bits in, but is usuable for sponsor-finding now
20:05:11 <darst> anything more?
20:05:16 <darst> #topic Sponsorship team status
20:05:20 <darst> anyone have questions here?
20:05:33 <aroundthfur> not atm
20:05:54 <darst> there is something about local media coverage?
20:05:57 <aroundthfur> vedran_omeragic, you said you have the leaflet done?
20:06:10 <vedran_omeragic> i havetext
20:06:13 <AbsintheSyringe> we can't have questions about this until we have the thing signed between diva and spi and ffis
20:06:20 <vedran_omeragic> template is not yet done
20:06:27 <darst> AbsintheSyringe, why not?
20:06:35 <vedran_omeragic> http://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf11/Sponsorship/MediaCoverage
20:06:50 <AbsintheSyringe> mainly because we can't go looking for money
20:07:03 <darst> AbsintheSyringe, you don't have to know where the money goes to ask people if they want to give it
20:07:07 * bdale is lurking
20:07:08 <aroundthfur> AbsintheSyringe, we can go look for it..
20:07:23 <aroundthfur> we are not getting the money on the same day anyway..
20:07:31 <AbsintheSyringe> in one of the previous meetings someone told me not to ask money until we got the diva thing sorted
20:07:36 <marga> AbsintheSyringe: indeed, you can always go looking for money
20:07:40 <AbsintheSyringe> k
20:07:43 <AbsintheSyringe> problem solved
20:07:44 <marga> Looking for money takes a long time.
20:08:25 <darst> tell them they can give in either euro to  a german nonprofit, or a bosnian NGO (probably), and it will be ready by then
20:08:30 <darst> this is what we said in the last meeting, too
20:08:36 <AbsintheSyringe> k
20:08:41 <edgar> well, if anyone raised the objection or knows what it is, they should explain
20:09:00 <edgar> btw, hi
20:09:15 <Clint> or USD to SPI
20:09:28 <darst> vedran_omeragic: quickly reading that page, it looks doable
20:09:55 <vedran_omeragic> darst, I wasn't planning on doing it like a brochure (A4 format)
20:09:58 <vedran_omeragic> rather something smaller
20:10:01 <darst> and a good start
20:10:45 <vedran_omeragic> with the aim of sending a clear message
20:11:00 <vedran_omeragic> since this is mostly for local media
20:11:19 <darst> all I can say is keep working on it and mail -tema if you have any questions, but it is good
20:11:26 <darst> is that what you want to know?
20:11:27 <vedran_omeragic> we'll have to clarify the difference between regular sponsors and and media 'partners'
20:11:42 <vedran_omeragic> yeah, that's pretty much it
20:12:07 <darst> #info vedran_omeragic working on MediaCoverage handout to give to various local media outlets
20:12:22 <darst> #topic Local updates - accommodation
20:12:38 <darst> #info We can get 160 beds at 38 €/night at Hotel Bosna
20:12:46 <AbsintheSyringe> I sent the email regarding accommodation
20:12:49 <darst> AbsintheSyringe, what more to say here?
20:12:52 <AbsintheSyringe> and regarding the food
20:13:03 <AbsintheSyringe> I changed my mind and will go to Banja Luka tomorrow after all
20:13:10 <AbsintheSyringe> I'm planning to talk to another hotel
20:13:15 <AbsintheSyringe> and I'm planning to get a really good price
20:13:21 <darst> #info we also have an offer of dorms that are 1.5 km away for free
20:13:32 <AbsintheSyringe> yea
20:13:39 <AbsintheSyringe> dorms are great, because they are pretty far away
20:13:42 <darst> given that we have a large amount from the government, enough to easily afford these hotels
20:13:45 <AbsintheSyringe> actually they are not, it's a nice walk
20:13:57 <darst> I think we should go with the hotels
20:13:58 <AbsintheSyringe> but we were planning to have shuttles leaving every morning after breakfast towards the venue
20:13:59 <darst> other opinions?
20:14:25 <AbsintheSyringe> heh I was saying that from the very beginning :)
20:14:30 <marga> AbsintheSyringe: how can dorms be great because they are far away?
20:14:36 <darst> from my understanding, closer together is always better
20:14:41 <AbsintheSyringe> but now we might have a problem because we need to book them fast
20:15:00 <marga> AbsintheSyringe: "far away" is NOT an advantage, and 1.5km sounds way too much.
20:15:04 <AbsintheSyringe> marga, I meant as they are good, they are not trashy in taht sort of way
20:15:14 <darst> after this meeting we can book them
20:15:35 <darst> any objections to hotels?
20:15:37 <marga> AbsintheSyringe: could you please clarify the availability of lodging places in the different locations?
20:15:42 <darst> (I wish more global people were here)
20:15:49 <AbsintheSyringe> marga, I understood that from very beginning and when I said let's go with hotels certain members said no, now don't go all that I'm the one who's pro for dorms
20:16:07 <AbsintheSyringe> darst, yes, we would need to book Bosna by 05-th
20:16:10 <AbsintheSyringe> 04th is the last day
20:16:11 <darst> marga, from my understanding then we will get more rooms in other nearby hotels, to get more than 160 beds
20:16:20 <marga> I'm sorry I was not there at the moment, but I guess it was related more to costs than to the fact that they were hotels.
20:16:44 <AbsintheSyringe> yea
20:16:49 <AbsintheSyringe> listen we'll do it like this
20:16:52 <AbsintheSyringe> I'm going to banja luka tomorrow
20:16:53 <marga> AbsintheSyringe: so, could you please clarify the different options? Please?
20:17:01 <AbsintheSyringe> I'll talk to two more hotels see how much room we can get
20:17:04 <AbsintheSyringe> and by a cheap price
20:17:17 <AbsintheSyringe> all those who can't fit in those hotels will go to dorms and case closed?
20:17:20 <edgar> im pro dorms also
20:17:45 * tiago here
20:17:46 <AbsintheSyringe> marga, there are hotels, a lot of them and dorms
20:17:47 * marga shrugs.
20:17:56 <darst> I propose we resere the 160 rooms, and then work getting similar prices for other hotels nearby
20:18:00 <AbsintheSyringe> marga, I'm not sure I understood the question :-/
20:18:11 <darst> and dorms are always another option
20:18:11 <AbsintheSyringe> darst, yes that's the plan
20:18:16 <AbsintheSyringe> yep
20:18:18 <AbsintheSyringe> backup plan
20:18:35 <darst> basically, take what we can, and then find overflow (more flexible with regards to number of people)
20:18:36 <marga> AbsintheSyringe: please don't "case close" anything before sharing details.
20:18:51 <Clint> bosna needs to be booked by the 4th of april?
20:19:01 <AbsintheSyringe> Clint, 5th
20:19:02 <marga> AbsintheSyringe: it's really very important to have things as close as possible.  Being 1.5km away is really TOO far for DebConf distances.
20:19:25 <AbsintheSyringe> marga, I know
20:19:29 <AbsintheSyringe> please understand the following
20:19:36 <AbsintheSyringe> I was always PRO hotels and the closer the better
20:19:42 <marga> AbsintheSyringe: so, if you go hunting for hotels, please inform the team about your hunting results, including amount of bed, price, distance to the main venue, before "case closing" anything.
20:19:43 <darst> are there any objections to what AbsintheSyringe and I proposed above ?
20:19:52 <AbsintheSyringe> then CERTAIN members started complaining on its prices that made me look for FREE alternative
20:20:00 <AbsintheSyringe> so please accusing me as it was my idea
20:20:11 <marga> AbsintheSyringe: I'm not accusing you of anything.
20:20:12 <AbsintheSyringe> marga, will do
20:20:15 <darst> can we agree to reserve 160 and then more space when we can
20:20:18 <edgar> you are doing a lot, don't worry about acusations
20:20:25 <edgar> &8'D
20:20:33 <AbsintheSyringe> because
20:20:34 <marga> AbsintheSyringe: I was not there.  I'm just asking you to not "case close" before telling the global team about it.
20:20:36 <AbsintheSyringe> if we agreed on that one
20:20:39 <AbsintheSyringe> I would do that tomorrow
20:20:42 <AbsintheSyringe> reserve Bosna
20:20:46 <AbsintheSyringe> and talk to the other two hotels
20:20:50 <darst> when do we need to pay if we reserve bosna?
20:20:53 <Clint> is that 80 rooms or what?
20:20:59 <marga> yes, I guess it's ok to reserve those 160 beds.
20:21:08 <AbsintheSyringe> darst, not sure, later on
20:21:11 <aroundthfur> marga, no body is case closing anything
20:21:19 <darst> and if you reserve, can you figure out how many total beds and total rooms we'll have?
20:21:28 <aroundthfur> we always report back to global team and then decide together!
20:21:29 <aroundthfur> :)
20:21:30 <marga> Yes, please
20:21:31 <AbsintheSyringe> marga, I meant it more hypothetically
20:21:32 <aroundthfur> don't worry!
20:21:50 <darst> #agreed Reserve the 160 beds(rooms?) in hotel bosna, look for more hotels in the area
20:21:51 <edgar> is there public transportation from the dorms (1.5 kms) to the venue?
20:21:52 <Clint> and the 38€ is without food?
20:21:57 <AbsintheSyringe> darst, well I'll ask them that, they told me that they would give me that info letter on
20:22:14 <AbsintheSyringe> edgar, we would have private shuttles from dorms to venue after breakfast
20:22:23 <AbsintheSyringe> Clint, breakfast
20:22:26 <edgar> yep, i heard that, thx,
20:22:34 <darst> #action AbsintheSyringe seeks total number of beds and total number of rooms in this reservation ASAP
20:22:48 <Clint> great
20:22:51 <edgar> i was just curious about public transportation because you cant run shuttles all day, can you?
20:23:24 <edgar> personally, i love to walk, i am just exploring the situation thouroughly
20:23:29 <AbsintheSyringe> there's public transportation
20:23:31 <darst> AbsintheSyringe: can you make them tell us number of rooms and beds when reserving?
20:23:35 <AbsintheSyringe> they wouldn't run all day
20:23:57 <AbsintheSyringe> darst, yea, I'm planning to ask them how many rooms/double/single are we getting for those 160 beds
20:23:58 <edgar> cool, thx!
20:23:59 <jaqm> #idea hold another meeting before April 4th about this, having the whole information about hotels, costs, location, etc
20:24:16 <AbsintheSyringe> not necessary if you ask me
20:24:33 <AbsintheSyringe> as I'll report back with direct info on costs of those hotels
20:24:34 <darst> AbsintheSyringe: can you tell them we want them, but want details before we sign anything?
20:24:35 <marga> AbsintheSyringe: what is not necessary?
20:24:50 <AbsintheSyringe> darst, sure
20:24:54 <jaqm> but you are negotiating with hotels on next days
20:25:09 <AbsintheSyringe> I'm negotiating tomorrow
20:25:14 <aroundthfur> jaqm, he's going to BL tomorrow
20:25:17 <aroundthfur> so yes
20:25:18 <darst> AbsintheSyringe, and then send us the info and we'll do final approval
20:25:19 <AbsintheSyringe> we can have meetings regarding the other hotels not Bosna
20:25:35 <AbsintheSyringe> we need to reserve Bosna by 5th and I'd rather do that asap instead of waiting for last day to do it
20:25:36 <jaqm> ok
20:25:56 <AbsintheSyringe> darst, ok
20:26:03 <darst> #info AbsintheSyringe will tell hotel we want rooms, but not sign or pay until we get info
20:26:17 <darst> #topic Local info - food
20:26:33 <darst> AbsintheSyringe, anyone can eat at bosna, even people not in the hotel, correct ?
20:26:41 <AbsintheSyringe> yea
20:26:57 <darst> #info Everyone can eat in bosna, even thouse not staying there
20:26:58 <aroundthfur> so we'll just make that default eating place?
20:27:24 <darst> can you ask them: can you accept money from people yourselves, and they can eat?
20:27:38 <darst> and ask them: how much in advance do you need to know the number of people per day?
20:28:06 <tassia> it would also be good to know how many meals they are able to prepair per day
20:28:09 <AbsintheSyringe> darst, please clarify the first question
20:28:31 <karora> AbsintheSyringe: Can they accept payment for those who are not sponsored for food.
20:28:34 <marga> AbsintheSyringe: how are we going to manage paying for the meals.
20:28:40 <darst> first question is: will they have a cash register that can take money and let people in, if they don't have our meal ticket
20:29:06 <tassia> just to be sure that everyone will be able to eat there...
20:29:06 <AbsintheSyringe> well this is how I was planning it
20:29:23 <AbsintheSyringe> when sponsored people are getting rooms, they have option if they are getting food as well
20:29:43 <AbsintheSyringe> later on when we are giving them accreditation it'll say if they can eat or not
20:29:58 <AbsintheSyringe> if they can't then they'll be able to pay for their own food by the costs we previously agreed to
20:30:23 <marga> AbsintheSyringe: who checks if they "can" or "can't" ?
20:30:36 <aroundthfur> can't we do the same thing as in NYC last year?
20:30:46 <AbsintheSyringe> someone at the entrance?
20:30:53 <aroundthfur> marga, we'll appoint someone at the entrance..
20:30:54 <AbsintheSyringe> even though I don't think that'll be necessary
20:31:05 <AbsintheSyringe> because we'll have swedish tables and there'll be plenty of food
20:31:14 <darst> how many days in advance will we have to tell the food service people how many meals to make?
20:31:27 <AbsintheSyringe> again
20:31:36 <aroundthfur> darst, we were thinking we make a buffet..
20:31:42 <AbsintheSyringe> it'll be swedish tables, with variety of food every different day
20:31:44 <aroundthfur> so no nr of meals..
20:31:49 <edgar> AbsintheSyringe, I agree completely with the not checking
20:32:10 <darst> DC10 was a buffet, but they still need to know how much to make
20:32:19 <AbsintheSyringe> so you eat as much sa you want
20:32:35 <darst> so the hotel will make "enough" food, and it doesn't matter how many people come?
20:32:36 <AbsintheSyringe> well I could ask them because when I asked him this he said there's no problem there'll be more then plenty of food
20:32:45 <AbsintheSyringe> all based on how many people are eating, total number
20:32:46 <aroundthfur> darst, yes but it doesn't have to be an exact number
20:32:57 <darst> 200 vs 300 is a big difference
20:33:05 <AbsintheSyringe> well we'll have those numbers
20:33:10 <aroundthfur> well yes
20:33:12 <AbsintheSyringe> by 15-10 is nothing
20:33:18 <aroundthfur> but we can always say a day before..
20:33:21 <AbsintheSyringe> you know something like
20:33:27 <AbsintheSyringe> on average tehre should be 300 people eating here
20:33:30 <darst> just make sure that the hotel really will deal with any number of people, and we only pay for who goes in, with no advance notice, and we will be good to go
20:33:31 <edgar> well, the crux of the question seems to be: how important is excluding those who are not sponsored?
20:33:33 <marga> aroundthfur / AbsintheSyringe: having someone at the entrance is very tiring for volunteers, it's best if we can avoid that, and let that job be done by someone from the hotel itself.
20:34:06 <darst> and make sure there is no risk to us if fewer (or more) people come (financial risk, and also running out of food risk)
20:34:11 <aroundthfur> marga, that could be arranged
20:34:30 <AbsintheSyringe> I think whole idea of having "food cops" is lame
20:34:37 <edgar> i agree
20:34:38 <AbsintheSyringe> if you got food you can go in there
20:34:43 <AbsintheSyringe> if not don't be an idiot and go in there to eat
20:34:55 <darst> is the hotel OK with us paying for 300 people and then not checking that only 300 peolpe come in?
20:35:01 <AbsintheSyringe> if I didnt have paid food I wouldn't just go in there to eat
20:35:01 <edgar> which is why im asking, who really cares about excluding the unauthorised?
20:35:03 <aroundthfur> AbsintheSyringe, there's always idiots around :)
20:35:08 <aroundthfur> but i agree with you!
20:35:21 <AbsintheSyringe> darst, yea I think so
20:35:24 <AbsintheSyringe> previously they had
20:35:38 <AbsintheSyringe> 600 people for that rafting championship I really doubt they were checking people
20:35:55 <edgar> maybe you wouldnt, absinthe, but someone will, the point is, does it bother you if a few people sneak in?
20:36:11 <AbsintheSyringe> president of hotel told me, they get enough food, what hurts him the most is that most of that food gets thrown away in the end
20:36:14 <blarson> edgar: only if we have to pay for them
20:36:19 <karora> People with non-sponsored food have various reasons for making that choice. Some of them will certainly be expecting/wanting to eat with the sponsored attendees but to pay for the privilege each time they do so.
20:36:20 <AbsintheSyringe> so I wouldn't have any coppers looking who can eat and can't
20:36:33 <darst> it doesn't bother me if the hotel pays for the extra food, as long as they know they are taking taht risk
20:36:34 <AbsintheSyringe> edgar, 5 per meal is not a lot?
20:36:39 <edgar> indeed
20:36:41 <darst> anyway,let's have adnan clarify this tomorrow
20:36:42 <darst> and go on
20:37:09 <darst> #info AbsintheSyringe will check tomorrow with hotel about food service arrangements per previous conversation
20:37:10 <jaqm> I realize the hotel calculates they can feed as much people as they can host, but it seems that at the venue will be people hosted in others places, maybe they won't expect +160 people
20:37:15 <edgar> i agree that we shouldnt have the cops! im just saying that people who dont agree should justify why its so important to exclude the freeloaders
20:37:47 <karora> If it helps fund debconf, we should sell meal tickets.
20:37:54 <AbsintheSyringe> no
20:38:02 <karora> That's why I would choose to not have sponsored food.
20:38:06 <darst> edgar: it is not important to us, it is presumably important to the hotel, and we don't want to show up and have the hotel blame us for letting too many people in
20:38:06 <edgar> if someone feels that they cant pay for the food, and need to sneak in, they probably really need it
20:38:07 <AbsintheSyringe> I hate food tickets
20:38:14 <AbsintheSyringe> please lets not have food tickets
20:38:20 <AbsintheSyringe> I mean
20:38:29 <AbsintheSyringe> that's just going to cause chaos among so many people
20:38:35 <AbsintheSyringe> then it's not cops, then it's FBI
20:38:44 <edgar> ok, darst, i get that, good point, but if were paying for all the food, presumably they wouldnt object
20:38:44 <marga> AbsintheSyringe: how is the hotel going to charge us for the meals?
20:39:02 <darst> also, not everyone will eat at the hotel for every mean - we don't want to pay if sponsored people choose to not to eat at the hotel a certain day
20:39:14 <AbsintheSyringe> marga, we'll pay for XXX number of people that will eat there and charge us by the number of people
20:39:54 <AbsintheSyringe> darst, well someone might come in for free meal, while the other one is out eating somewhere else
20:39:59 <darst> edgar: that's why they presumably want to know how many people will be there, sothey can prepare enough... DC10, that cafeteria hosted > 1000 people per day, and they _still_ wanted to know within 10-15 people how many would be there
20:40:02 <AbsintheSyringe> so in the end the number should balance itself out
20:40:03 <edgar> if that is the case i can almost garantee that the hotel will ask for the policing, at least if its like any hotel ive known
20:40:16 <AbsintheSyringe> we're making it complicated without reason
20:40:21 <AbsintheSyringe> next topic?
20:40:28 <darst> AbsintheSyringe: talk to the hotel and see how flexible they are, and report back to us
20:40:32 <AbsintheSyringe> darst, ;)
20:40:35 <darst> #topic Local updates - venue
20:40:36 <marga> AbsintheSyringe: so, how is that number of people going to be counted?
20:40:55 <darst> AbsintheSyringe: the other day, was it hotel staff or venue staff who said we shouldn't eat in the venue?
20:40:56 <AbsintheSyringe> marga, by number of people who register for food sponsored/non sponsored in penta
20:41:06 <AbsintheSyringe> darst, city
20:41:18 <darst> ok, that was my main question
20:41:23 <darst> any other venue updates?
20:41:34 <AbsintheSyringe> nope
20:41:45 <tiago> meals topic seemed to not be finished, we need to back on it later
20:41:47 <darst> didn't think so, but that's OK - as long as we have it, we are good
20:42:00 <AbsintheSyringe> we have it
20:42:05 <darst> tiago, yes, but we need info... don't think there is much more progress there
20:42:09 <AbsintheSyringe> I'm also planning to meet with mayor tomorrow, to conclude that one
20:42:13 <darst> #topic Registration plan
20:42:20 <AbsintheSyringe> and have the venue given to us, and signed on paper that we have it
20:42:27 <AbsintheSyringe> well
20:42:34 <AbsintheSyringe> the plan was to start registrations on 1st
20:42:34 <darst> AbsintheSyringe, can you comment on how possible this is:
20:42:35 <darst> http://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf11/Registration#Reserving_your_own_accommodations_.28unsponsored.2FCorporate_attendees.29
20:42:46 <tiago> darst: ok, just to register we didn't decided yet for free meals for everyone
20:43:34 <aroundthfur> tiago, no
20:43:53 <aroundthfur> we will continue the discussion after we have more info
20:44:37 <AbsintheSyringe> yea
20:44:40 <AbsintheSyringe> this looks good
20:44:59 <darst> can you ask the hotel how they will handle it?
20:45:20 <darst> will that count as part of our rooms, or be in addition to our rooms?
20:45:27 <AbsintheSyringe> no
20:45:32 <AbsintheSyringe> that will count as part of our rooms
20:45:39 <AbsintheSyringe> that's why I said give them the price we got for sponsored
20:45:43 <AbsintheSyringe> I already asked him that
20:45:55 <darst> and if one of those people doesn't show up, who pays for the room?
20:46:22 <AbsintheSyringe> I guess we do
20:46:28 <AbsintheSyringe> but imagine this scenario
20:46:45 <AbsintheSyringe> if we are already paying for the rooms I mean it would suck if we lose them and they are so close
20:46:50 <AbsintheSyringe> let's say we get another hotel
20:47:00 <AbsintheSyringe> and we have 300 beds in total
20:47:11 <AbsintheSyringe> more people register, and we start placing them in dorms or whatever
20:47:14 <AbsintheSyringe> if someone cancels
20:47:21 <AbsintheSyringe> you just tell someone from dorms would you like to move to hotel
20:47:26 <AbsintheSyringe> I'm sure many people would like to hear that
20:47:33 <darst> right, yes, that is possible
20:47:42 <AbsintheSyringe> just send an email on mailing list it should be occupied in matter of minutes
20:47:45 <AbsintheSyringe> go with that one then?
20:47:52 <darst> and if dorms are free, that doesn't cost us anything
20:48:02 <AbsintheSyringe> dorms will be free
20:48:11 <AbsintheSyringe> at least 100-120 beds
20:48:12 <AbsintheSyringe> as of now
20:48:20 <AbsintheSyringe> and yea they won't cost anything
20:48:29 <AbsintheSyringe> except the shuttles
20:48:30 <darst> but - marga, etc, said that dorms would probably be too far, so we should do more hotels instead
20:48:33 <darst> which I agree with
20:48:36 <AbsintheSyringe> yea
20:48:42 <AbsintheSyringe> we are going with hotels
20:48:47 <AbsintheSyringe> I'm just saying in case we
20:48:48 <AbsintheSyringe> get
20:48:51 <AbsintheSyringe> even if we get 3 hotels
20:48:53 <AbsintheSyringe> and we place
20:48:58 <AbsintheSyringe> 400 people in there
20:49:11 <AbsintheSyringe> hypothetically if more people signs up we should place them in dorms
20:49:16 <AbsintheSyringe> because it would cost too much money
20:49:36 <AbsintheSyringe> but maybe it's just ridiculous to talk about this since it's "out of reach" right now
20:49:44 <AbsintheSyringe> that is we haven't got all the hotels situation sorted
20:49:51 <AbsintheSyringe> let's talk about this once we have all the hotels reserved
20:50:00 <AbsintheSyringe> and we have the final number of beds/single/double
20:50:03 <AbsintheSyringe> ok?
20:50:30 <darst> I am still wary until we know how things will work
20:50:43 <AbsintheSyringe> what things?
20:51:04 <AbsintheSyringe> listen
20:51:06 <AbsintheSyringe> would any of you
20:51:11 <AbsintheSyringe> I actually talked to govt regarding this
20:51:19 <AbsintheSyringe> would any of you like to come here and check it out all?
20:51:28 <AbsintheSyringe> so you could get a better picture of how it's all planned
20:51:33 * tiago leaving to class,sorry
20:51:40 <AbsintheSyringe> I mean I can't even figure out how you picture bosnia, so this might help
20:51:45 <darst> that would help, but I can't right now
20:51:58 <AbsintheSyringe> maybe email the mailing list?
20:51:59 * tassia also leaving for class
20:52:00 <darst> but perhaps someone from europe could go and it would help a lot - it helped with DC9
20:52:04 <marga> Yes.
20:52:11 <marga> Maybe moray
20:52:17 <aroundthfur> who here is closest to bosnia?
20:52:20 <AbsintheSyringe> yep, h01ger ?
20:52:21 <darst> unless they want to pay for transatlantic flight for me, but that is excessie
20:52:26 <marga> He's been involved with DC11 and is closer than darst :)
20:52:39 <marga> Or holger, yes
20:52:40 <AbsintheSyringe> yea
20:52:47 <AbsintheSyringe> moray and/or h01ger
20:52:59 * karora volunteers :-)
20:53:13 <darst> but a lot of this would be them talking to these same venues and sorting out details which we haven't been able to get in IRC
20:53:18 <karora> (that's a joke, btw)
20:53:27 <darst> AbsintheSyringe, could the gov provide funding to do this?
20:53:48 <AbsintheSyringe> I don't know, could ask, because I'll be seeing the minister tomorrow
20:53:49 <darst> or would it come out of what they have given us?
20:53:54 <AbsintheSyringe> or that
20:53:55 <AbsintheSyringe> :)
20:54:07 <darst> it would still be reasonable to come out of what they have given us
20:54:08 <marga> Ok, please try to find out, I think it's a good idea.
20:54:18 <AbsintheSyringe> I'll talk to them tomorrow regarding this
20:54:26 <AbsintheSyringe> ok, sounds good
20:54:40 <darst> (moray and I had actually talked of that earlier, in the event I end up in europe this summer)
20:54:58 <darst> back to registration
20:55:04 <AbsintheSyringe> yea, I remember telling you to come here and check it out even before we got the bid
20:55:09 <Ganneff> i just created initial dc11 entr yin pentabarf.
20:55:18 <AbsintheSyringe> \o/
20:55:34 <AbsintheSyringe> darst, ok I'll have that arranged
20:56:13 <darst> AbsintheSyringe, if you could make some sort of page describing who goes where, who registers where, and who pays for what, then we can be confident in the plan
20:56:57 <darst> but until we have instructions for professional peolpe, we can't open registration
20:57:03 <urbec> What about people, who might get sponsored for debconf, but not for debcamp?
20:57:22 <aroundthfur> urbec, what do you mean?
20:57:31 <darst> urbec: good point...
20:57:53 <aroundthfur> should there be a different procedure?
20:58:12 <urbec> people attending debcamp and are not sponsored for this, eg volunteers.
20:58:12 <darst> urbec: I would probably say simplest is that they register as sponsored, and we ask for a "donation"/payment for the debcamp portion...
20:58:21 <AbsintheSyringe> yea, we really need to come up with plan for that
20:58:26 <AbsintheSyringe> for example
20:58:45 <darst> since they are connected enough to be sponsored for the conf itself
20:58:46 <AbsintheSyringe> once the person pays for accommodation by the price he got (our price) where is that money going to
20:58:51 <AbsintheSyringe> us, or hotel, I guess it would be us
20:59:07 <AbsintheSyringe> I guess the best way to solve tihs one is
20:59:22 <AbsintheSyringe> by starting discussion on mailing lists since we could all hear all kind of suggestions
21:00:19 <darst> these things are what we need to know to open registration...
21:00:29 <darst> and thus we need a plan soon
21:00:40 <AbsintheSyringe> ok
21:00:53 <AbsintheSyringe> who will volunteer to start discussion on the mailing list asking all these questions
21:00:54 <darst> I am wondering if we just have to go with the DC9/DC10 system and abandon the reserve-with-hotel-directly until DC12
21:01:03 <AbsintheSyringe> I believe we could solve most of these pretty quickly
21:01:08 <darst> marga: --^
21:01:21 <AbsintheSyringe> or that
21:01:29 <marga> darst: reserving with hotel directly has advantages and disadvantages.
21:01:45 <marga> Adv: we don't handle the money
21:01:46 <darst> since most global team wanted pay-hotel-directly was what most peolpe had wanted, I don't want to abandon it so fast
21:02:04 <marga> Disadv: it's extra hassle for attendees
21:02:14 <marga> Adv: we don't have to deal with where everyone goes.
21:02:25 <aroundthfur> darst, why do we have to have a different procedure for debcamp?
21:02:25 <aroundthfur> darst, in the worst case scenario we could just act as a proxy for everyone..
21:02:25 <aroundthfur> we will just appoint some more ppl for that task..
21:02:28 <darst> Adv: we don't have to be a travel agent when things change
21:02:28 <aroundthfur> it should be doable..
21:02:33 <marga> Disadv: people have to find a roommate or else the hotel finds one for them
21:03:10 <marga> darst: I'm not really inclined toward one or the other...
21:03:18 <darst> I propose we delay this discussion to the mailing list, and force a decision within 48 hours
21:03:29 <darst> worst case is DC9/10 system
21:03:34 <darst> can we agree on that?
21:03:52 <aroundthfur> darst, what was the DC9/10 system?
21:04:06 <darst> everyone pays us and we deal with the group reservations
21:04:13 <aroundthfur> ok
21:04:24 <aroundthfur> then i agree with your suggestion
21:04:27 <marga> darst: I agree with that.
21:04:46 <darst> #agreed Discuss registration system on mailing list, decision within 48 hours (prof. book with us vs prof. book with hotel)
21:05:06 <darst> #info we don't have enough information now to have people book directly with hotel without risk to us
21:05:15 <darst> #topic Debian&DIVA agreement
21:05:28 <darst> http://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf11/NGOMoney describes the agreement
21:05:39 <darst> it seems well agreeded upon
21:05:51 <AbsintheSyringe> yep
21:05:54 <darst> any objectsions?  Get zack to send and be done?
21:06:19 <AbsintheSyringe> yea
21:06:21 <darst> #agreed the agreement looks good, get it sent and let's move on
21:06:25 <darst> #topic call for papers
21:06:39 <darst> #info gwolf said ey'd work on this
21:06:46 <Ganneff> includes penta, i guess?
21:07:00 <darst> http://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf11/CallForPapers is what we have so far
21:07:11 <darst> part of it would need penta so they can submit them, yes
21:07:18 <Ganneff> i do have a numbe rof notes and tips for him there, currently writing them down on paste.d.n
21:07:38 <Ganneff> will give him skinner access too, and if he has penta foo so i can look again tomorrow ill find them there and help out
21:07:39 <darst> #info gwolf can head this team, will get CfP out by this weekend
21:07:40 <Ganneff> but then im off
21:07:45 <darst> (I think that is correct...)
21:07:48 <darst> Ganneff: thanks
21:07:55 <Ganneff> if there arent many changes wanted for penta, its easy
21:08:00 <Ganneff> the basic conference is there now
21:08:06 <darst> there shouldn't be many changes, I hope
21:08:13 <Ganneff> good
21:08:32 <darst> my goal was as few as possible
21:08:55 <darst> I would #action gwolf, but if ey can't confirm here...
21:09:01 <darst> #topic Add FAQ page to website, and add all additional questions/answers
21:09:09 <darst> Who added this?  It seems unobjectionable
21:09:17 <AbsintheSyringe> I did
21:09:22 <darst> http://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf11/FAQ is a current wiki FAQ
21:09:25 <AbsintheSyringe> because people ask questions
21:09:26 <aroundthfur> i'll take care of that
21:09:28 <AbsintheSyringe> yea but
21:09:34 <aroundthfur> with help of vedran_omeragic
21:09:37 <AbsintheSyringe> we need to have it all transferred to website
21:09:45 <aroundthfur> he needs to put it on the website
21:09:46 <AbsintheSyringe> yea darst just mark it as that
21:09:53 <AbsintheSyringe> and add questions/answers
21:10:03 <karora> Wouldn't it be better to just link from the website to the FAQ in the wiki?
21:10:04 <darst> if you leave it on the wiki then people can continue to add to it (since it'll never be done)... just link to it
21:10:07 <darst> but, it is up to you
21:10:09 <AbsintheSyringe> people asking pretty simple questions and keep repeating themselves
21:10:11 <vedran_omeragic> aroundthfur, i'll lend a hand
21:10:22 <karora> It would seem to make the page more responsive to new questions if we just did a link.
21:10:32 <aroundthfur> darst, we can add an FAQ section on the website
21:10:45 <aroundthfur> that will have links to wiki and everywhere we have answers..
21:10:55 <karora> Just for teh really big questions, perhaps, and then link to the wiki for further ones.
21:10:58 <marga> You could have both, adding a FAQ page and then a link to the wiki
21:11:01 <darst> sure
21:11:04 <aroundthfur> but some ppl don't know about the wiki page so..
21:11:09 <marga> But I guess that's mostly a decision for who is going to do it.
21:11:10 <AbsintheSyringe> yea
21:11:18 <AbsintheSyringe> sounds good
21:11:19 <darst> #info they'll add FAQ page to website, and link to wiki, and other useful resources
21:11:22 <aroundthfur> marga, don't worry about it :)
21:11:33 <darst> #topic travel@debconf.org not working/what's happening with list of people who need visas?
21:11:37 <AbsintheSyringe> what's happening with this one?
21:11:44 <darst> is visa@debconf.org set up yet?
21:11:47 <aroundthfur> i said it earlier today..
21:11:48 <AbsintheSyringe> no
21:12:04 <aroundthfur> i can't make a list of ppl without knowing who is coming to DC11..
21:12:05 <Ganneff> define not working?
21:12:08 <AbsintheSyringe> also what happened to wiki/website that has all the numbers of total visitors from each country that need visa
21:12:10 <Ganneff> and visa@ is setup afaik
21:12:13 <aroundthfur> can't do anything regarding this..
21:12:28 <aroundthfur> AbsintheSyringe, i just said it..
21:12:31 <AbsintheSyringe> Ganneff, just got an email today from dc12 team saying it was bounced back
21:12:32 <edgar> what is travel@ going to be used for, or are you getting rid of that one?
21:12:39 <Ganneff> actually, it still points to dc10. wow
21:12:45 <Ganneff> so, wtf wants visa@?
21:12:46 <jaqm> I'm receiving no emails from anything around visa-team.. ?!
21:13:09 <Ganneff> and travel@ is entirely new to me. if you give me a target for it i can do it now, if not pester h01ger or schultmc later
21:13:14 <jaqm> only our private emails
21:13:18 <edgar> im not sure we need both, is why i'm asking
21:13:26 <darst> #info visa@dc.o wasn't set up, will be set up now
21:13:38 <Ganneff> gimme a comma seperated list of recipients for visa@ and thats done
21:13:41 <darst> travel@ is new to me too... can it be visa@ for visas, and registration@ for other questions ?
21:13:46 <edgar> lets decide now, i think
21:13:57 <darst> I generally vote for fewer addresses
21:14:00 <aroundthfur> darst, that seems about right..
21:14:09 <aroundthfur> visa@ and registration@
21:14:11 <edgar> i would say visas@ rather than visa@
21:14:13 <aroundthfur> it's enough..
21:14:14 <darst> so I say registration@ for any reg or travel suggestions
21:14:20 <edgar> ok
21:14:27 <darst> s/suggestions/questions/
21:14:29 <Ganneff> edgar: no, it has always been visa@, dont go away from tradition
21:14:34 <aroundthfur> edgar, visa/visas..same thing :9
21:14:36 <edgar> ok, cool!
21:14:39 <edgar> no prob
21:14:42 <darst> whatever past years used
21:14:43 <jaqm> :)
21:14:46 <edgar> didnt know
21:14:51 <blarson> extra ailases that point to the same list don't cost anything and can make it easier for users.
21:15:09 <aroundthfur> blarson, but then ppl will come asking which one to use...
21:15:22 <darst> who is sending Ganneff the visa list?
21:15:37 <darst> I can get the global part of the registration team
21:15:41 <aroundthfur> visa list?
21:15:44 <darst> (in a day)
21:15:53 <edgar> thx, i dont know either
21:15:54 <darst> oops, visa list --> list of people to be listening there
21:15:59 <edgar> ahh
21:16:06 <aroundthfur> darst, http://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf11/Teams#Visa_team
21:16:14 <edgar> so far as i know, that would be me, aroundthfur and jaqm
21:16:17 <darst> #action darst makes sure that visa@ and registration@ get set up properly (so that we can move on)
21:16:24 <darst> #topic Next meeting
21:16:32 <darst> #topic Next meeting & Any other business
21:16:34 <AbsintheSyringe> BL liasons is useful
21:16:41 <AbsintheSyringe> useless*
21:16:46 <aroundthfur> ok so we should make a poll regarding the time of the meetings..
21:16:52 <darst> AbsintheSyringe, yes, there will be multiple local peolpe on registration@
21:17:00 <AbsintheSyringe> k
21:17:01 <aroundthfur> AbsintheSyringe, i agree
21:17:08 <darst> #info we will have a poll for new meeting time
21:17:08 <AbsintheSyringe> have them removed?
21:17:19 <darst> should next meeting be in one week or two weeks or three weeks?
21:17:22 <AbsintheSyringe> 2
21:17:27 <aroundthfur> 2
21:17:32 <darst> I agree
21:17:36 <darst> #info next meeting in two weeks
21:17:40 <darst> aroundthfur, you'll make the poll?
21:17:49 <aroundthfur> darst, yes
21:18:00 <aroundthfur> but can we have a rough estimate of the time?
21:18:16 <aroundthfur> 18:00 - 20:00
21:18:17 <aroundthfur> ??
21:18:20 <darst> I would make the poll for various evening times Monday - Thuersday
21:18:27 <aroundthfur> yes
21:18:35 <aroundthfur> i was thinking the same thing
21:18:43 <darst> 18 to 20 seems reasonable to me... some people said earlier or later, you can decide
21:18:44 <aroundthfur> just the time of the day was my question..
21:18:49 <edgar> does anyone need the change of day?
21:18:50 <aroundthfur> ok..
21:18:54 <darst> Any other busisess ?
21:19:10 <AbsintheSyringe> um
21:19:12 <karora> We end summer time this coming weekend, so I'll probably only manage to catch the tail-end of meetings from now.
21:19:17 <darst> tiago had something:
21:19:20 <AbsintheSyringe> just curious estimate when could penta be finished?
21:19:23 <Ganneff> i dont know jaqm, can someone i know (darst, AbsintheSyringe, ...) just say "yes, he is the visa@ target" please?
21:19:23 <darst> 16:50 <tiago> http://debconf11.debconf.org/
21:19:23 <darst> 16:50 <tiago> header image is too large
21:20:18 <AbsintheSyringe> could we leave that one for later on
21:20:23 <AbsintheSyringe> we have much higher priorities right now
21:20:34 <aroundthfur> YES!
21:20:44 <aroundthfur> i don't think it's a problem..
21:20:49 <aroundthfur> the header i mean..
21:20:52 <Ganneff> meh. /me waits for darst to come up with the mail address list
21:21:13 <aroundthfur> Ganneff, well there's only 4 of us in the visa team
21:21:24 <aroundthfur> if you don't trust us, we need to change that :)
21:21:51 <edgar> who is the fourth, aroundthfur?
21:22:05 <aroundthfur> vedran_omeragic,
21:22:12 <vedran_omeragic> ready and able
21:22:13 <edgar> cool! thx
21:22:18 <darst> Ganneff: I am not quite sure... http://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf11/Teams#Visa_team
21:22:37 <Ganneff> darst: you know, i asked for email list... (but jaqm just managed one in query)
21:22:38 <darst> aroundthfur, vedran_omeragic, and jaqm, yes
21:22:38 <aroundthfur> AbsintheSyringe, could you guarantee for me and vedran_omeragic ??
21:22:47 <darst> jaqm: can you past the mail list here?
21:22:50 <AbsintheSyringe> yes :)
21:23:00 <darst> edgar: were you part, too ?
21:23:05 <AbsintheSyringe> I do
21:23:05 <jaqm> here?
21:23:09 <aroundthfur> darst, i've sent the emails to h01ger..
21:23:22 <darst> let's deal with this after meeting
21:23:25 <darst> #endmeeting