17:31:18 #startmeeting tor-browser 4/29 17:31:18 Meeting started Mon Apr 29 17:31:18 2019 UTC. The chair is GeKo. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 17:31:18 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic. 17:31:33 alright, let's get this going 17:32:32 the week is a bit short in some jurisdictions (due to 5/1 being public holiday) but still let's see what we can achieve 17:32:43 https://storm.torproject.org/shared/tHoN4Ii7rLSjPE0OP4gydX4cMGadsXmRQNc-6lwru0N is the usual meeting pad 17:33:00 please enter your items and mark things bold you want to talk about 17:33:55 * GeKo waits for others showing up 17:34:06 hi 17:34:17 * mcs is reading the pad 17:34:25 * brade is reading the pad 17:34:51 hi 17:35:49 hi 17:36:15 do we have sysrqb here? 17:36:42 hi, sorry I'm a bit late 17:37:55 o/ 17:38:31 okay, it seems we have no sysrqb here, which is a pity :( 17:38:38 but let's get started anyway 17:39:33 i am first it seems 17:39:51 are we still cool with out plan to prepare 8.5 later this week? 17:40:11 if not please speak up 17:40:38 the alternative would be to put it out with 60.7.0esr which is in about two weeks 17:41:24 the advantage of getting the release out early next week is that we have a bit time to fix things for the release based on 60.7.0esr 17:41:38 in case there are blockers showing up which we missed so far 17:41:59 It seems like there are almost always a couple of things we miss so having a fix up release planned is a good idea. 17:42:55 well, we could just spin one up after tor browser based on 60.7.0esr got out if needed 17:43:08 o/ 17:43:23 so i realize that's not really an argument :) 17:43:52 that said i guess i need to sync with sysrqb for that one as he has most stakes in the remaining 8.5-must bugs 17:44:08 but so far i'll aim to have things ready on thursay for building 17:45:05 so i'm going to spend today seeing if I hacking prebuilt midl bits into the build fixes our screen reader issue, and if it works we could probably test that in alpha later this week 17:45:12 *thursday 17:45:30 well there is no alpha planned before 8.5 gets out :) 17:45:32 don't know how that interacts with your release schedule plan 17:46:10 i guess whatever we get out in that regard into 8.5 17:46:25 won't make things worse for folks with accessiblity tools 17:46:42 so, i think we could skip the alpha part here 17:46:55 what we can do though is make some nightly builds to give folks on #27503 17:47:02 to check things out 17:47:13 ok that works for me 17:48:00 okay, anything else for the group regarding status updates? 17:48:48 okay, then lets move on to the discussion part 17:49:11 the stockholm meeting is coming and we should think a bit about team related sessions we want to have 17:49:45 how many sessions would we need as a team for doing all our core team related stuff 17:49:54 for planning the next, say, 6 months? 17:50:01 what do folks think? 17:50:48 is a session an hour long? 17:51:13 45min 17:51:19 and then we have a 15min break 17:51:35 so there is a one hours slot for each session 17:51:39 *hour 17:51:43 I would like to do something related to time estimations similar to what the network team did in brussels :) 17:52:01 what did they do? 17:52:59 they figured out a system for estimating points on tasks, also things like trying to figure out the team capacity 17:53:22 e.g how many days are actually spent on roadmap/project work versus other things like code reviews, bug fixing, etc... 17:53:55 it will hopefully help us make better time estimations for proposals 17:54:27 okay, sounds like a good idea 17:54:33 this would be one slot? 17:54:39 yuop 17:54:40 or do you plan two hours for that 17:54:44 okay 17:54:49 hopefully one is enough 17:55:17 i guess we'd want some retrospective session? 17:55:27 then some roadmapping sessions? 17:55:40 i suppose we'd need two for those 17:55:54 there are some thorny issues that may come up 17:56:01 might be useful to bring in someone from the network team to 'consult' during the time estimation session 17:56:08 (like should we leave the esr train for at least mobile etc.) 17:56:43 yeah, or pili gets all the info "extracted" before the sesssion 17:56:56 or we consult afterwards and adapt 17:57:02 I can look into that :) 17:57:25 that seems like for core sessions for now 17:57:30 is that reasonable? 17:57:33 upcoming tb features discussions? per-site sec settings, onion related progress 17:58:04 i hope the per-site sec settings are done by the meeting :) 17:58:23 oh 17:58:52 okey :) 17:59:21 well, we said last week that pospeselr would start working on the remaining bits of #25658 once 8.5 is out 17:59:43 god willing :) 17:59:44 and i think until mid-july that should be enough time for the per-site settings 17:59:52 yeah I agree 18:00:02 (but yes, there is other work that will come up, but still) 18:00:59 antonela: anything specific regarding upcoming tb features that might merit an own session? 18:01:13 we'll be busy from july to october with tor browser 9 18:01:22 asn may want to lead an onion one i think 18:01:33 so that does not leave much room until the next meeting 18:01:34 matt some tba 18:01:51 yep 18:01:54 yeah, there will be other sessions that are related to part of tor browser 18:02:23 the first step here is to get meeting ideas that are mostly concerned with the team 18:03:10 okay, i think getting back to flexlibris with those 4 items is a good start 18:03:18 it won't be set in stone 18:03:25 yep, sounds good 18:03:53 and we'll solicit further ideas later on once the schedule is closer to something substantial 18:03:54 I also was thinking about following on the vision discussions for longer term 18:04:00 if people feel interested and there is time 18:04:05 oh, yes 18:04:09 we should do that 18:04:15 5th meeting 18:04:18 yes 18:05:38 okay, thanks. that's been helpful 18:05:46 anything else to discuss for today? 18:06:19 can we talk about our plan for migrating to esr68? 18:06:53 you mean at the meeting or now? 18:07:04 (dev meeting that is) 18:07:09 now 18:07:19 sure 18:07:20 why are we waiting until July to start? 18:07:52 oh, no we are not waiting until july 18:07:58 could we start some of the process next month to reduce risk down the road? 18:08:27 what i meant was that from july to october the whole team will be busy preparing the esr68-based release 18:08:49 while before that just parts of the team will work on a bunch of issues 18:09:19 in fact we are already working partly on this topic, see the mingw-clang toolchain preparation 18:09:29 :-) 18:09:51 i've filed bugs for the toolchain updates in the morning, #30320 is the parent 18:10:30 for one of the two really big things we should get seriously working on before esr68 gets out in july 18:10:39 the other one is rebasing the patches 18:10:56 and we should start with that once 68 moves to beta 18:11:02 which is in about two weeks 18:11:09 I’d like to see us have a buildable tree throughout the process of rebasing patches (after the toolchain is figured out) 18:11:35 what does that mean? 18:12:13 last time the tree couldn’t be built/run because the patches weren’t applied in order 18:12:29 it made it much harder for me and mcs to help with rebasing 18:12:48 okay, i did not know that 18:12:59 that's definitely a thing we should avoid 18:13:03 I guess whoever takes the lead on rebasing can coordinate with anyone who will help. 18:13:04 :-) 18:13:19 yeah, so while we are talking about it 18:13:51 my preliminary plan was that acat would lead the rebasing project (i heard he has experiences with patch rebasing ;) ) 18:14:00 and sysrqb would do the mobile part 18:14:00 :-) 18:14:09 brade/mcs the updater patches 18:14:16 and i'll review the whole result 18:14:51 we can think about that plan a bit and nail it down like next week or the week thereafter 18:15:12 sounds good to me 18:15:39 and then we'll have a rebased branch hopefully earlier than all the other times before :) 18:15:49 *cough* 18:16:38 i wonder how much changes will torbutton and tor-launcher need for 68... 18:16:46 *many 18:17:52 yes, integrating torbutton into tor-browser for esr68 will be the third larger item we should figure out beforehand 18:18:04 i think for tor-launcher there should not be so many, though 18:18:15 For TL, there is #29197 at least 18:18:22 yeah 18:18:59 yes, was thinking of overlays too 18:19:09 figuring the torbutton story out is the other big item i need to get back after 8.5 is finally out 18:20:28 i might need help with that one though due to time limitations 18:20:33 not sure yet but we'll see 18:20:59 okay, anything else for today? 18:21:18 sisbell: i could need some help with #30169. let's chat afterward in #tor-dev? 18:21:27 sure 18:22:17 thanks everyone and have a nice week *baf* 18:22:20 #endmeeting