17:00:26 <phw> #startmeeting anti-censorship weekly checkin 2019-06-13
17:00:26 <MeetBot> Meeting started Thu Jun 13 17:00:26 2019 UTC.  The chair is phw. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
17:00:26 <MeetBot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
17:00:30 <phw> hi everyone o/
17:00:34 <Samdney> hi
17:00:45 <phw> here's our meeting pad: https://pad.riseup.net/p/tor-censorship-2019-keep
17:01:20 <phw> let's jump straight to our discussion point
17:01:37 <phw> we finally heard back from tor's research safety board about our bridgedb proposal
17:01:51 <phw> here's what the reviewer wrote: https://bugs.torproject.org/9316#comment:25
17:01:53 * cohosh is here but distracted by another meeting
17:02:07 * arma5 is here but also in another meeting
17:03:18 <phw> basically, the reviewer is concerned about statistics that include very few users
17:03:49 <phw> i think the best way forward is to implement the proposal and run it for a short amount of time, say a week
17:04:02 <dcf1> "Let's run an initial one-off experiment for one week and re-evaluate if the data is safe to publish?" I think that's good, the review even says short-term is no question.
17:04:12 <phw> then, we can have a look at the resulting data and reconsider if we see any anonymity problems
17:04:13 <gaba> o/
17:04:14 <arma5> great
17:04:43 <cohosh> +1
17:05:03 <phw> great, i'll try to move forward with the bridgedb patch over the next few days.  it's about halfway done.
17:05:20 <dcf1> what kind of implementation are we talking? I know I suggested some wild-eyed ideas.
17:05:34 <dcf1> didn't mean to create a lot of work.
17:06:41 <phw> dcf1: for now, the first four points in section 4 of: https://lists.torproject.org/pipermail/anti-censorship-team/attachments/20190425/d76339db/attachment-0001.pdf
17:06:49 <phw> sorry, section 3
17:07:15 <phw> i'm open to including heuristics too as they are very useful but i think we need to think a bit more about how to do this safely
17:07:22 <dcf1> ok
17:08:02 <phw> section 4 has an example of a potential issue with the heuristics.  let me know if i'm wrong or unnecessarily concerned
17:08:48 <dcf1> First 4 points sound good to me.
17:09:26 <phw> ok, we have two action items on our agenda
17:10:07 <phw> first, if you have experience with our pluggable transports spec, please respond to the following thread with your feedback: https://lists.torproject.org/pipermail/tor-dev/2019-June/013879.html
17:10:44 <phw> (this is part of our effort to improve the PT spec.  in the first step, we're compiling all the shortcomings and suggestions from implementers.)
17:10:51 <dcf1> you may want to include twisteroidambassador on that thread (https://github.com/twisteroidambassador/ptadapter)
17:11:06 <phw> i've already pointed several implementers (e.g. from psiphon, lantern, and i2p) to it
17:11:09 <dcf1> That's the only manager-side implementation of the PT spec I'm aware of, other than Tor itself.
17:11:37 <phw> oh, thanks dcf1
17:12:42 <dcf1> Oh, and I think Operator Foundation may have an implementation (of PT 2.0), offhand I'm not sure if it's manager-side or plugin-side only though.
17:13:14 <phw> yes, brandon sent me some links.  i'll add them to the ticket after this meeting.
17:13:34 <arma5> do we know the shadowsocks people? do we think the free beer person on the mailing list is a shadowsocks person?
17:14:17 <phw> fyi, we started collecting PT spec implementations here: https://trac.torproject.org/projects/tor/ticket/29285#comment:5
17:14:18 <arma5> phw: the tunnelbear people use obfs4 right? do we know if they use the PT API side of it?
17:14:45 <phw> arma5: good question, i don't know.  i'll see if i can get in touch with anyone from there.
17:15:41 <phw> "there" being tunnelbear and shadowsocks.
17:16:45 <phw> our second action item is about stockholm.  if you want to attend/lead any anti-censorship sessions, please add them to the following pad: https://pad.riseup.net/p/_kDAK09C16xL2lBRQ7sJ
17:17:54 <phw> any other impromptu discussions/announcements?
17:18:32 <phw> ok, let's move on to "needs help with"
17:19:11 * phw notices that cohosh has some "needs help" items
17:19:43 <cohosh> i already pinged GeKo about the windows toolchain item
17:19:46 <dcf1> I'm still planning to look at #29206, sorry I've had some other projects to work on
17:19:56 <cohosh> dcf1: thanks! and no worries
17:20:31 <phw> i'll do my best to review #21315
17:20:54 <cohosh> phw: thanks!
17:21:10 <GeKo> cohosh: it might need to wait a bit more :( i won't get to it this week anymore and am at mozilla's all hands next week :(
17:21:30 <arma5> phw: i emailed you a tunnelbear contact
17:21:35 <phw> thanks arma5
17:21:56 <cohosh> GeKo: no worries, thanks
17:22:51 <phw> i think we're good for today.  anything left?
17:23:25 <phw> #endmeeting