17:00:49 #startmeeting 17:00:49 Meeting started Mon Aug 8 17:00:49 2016 UTC. The chair is nickm. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 17:00:49 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic. 17:00:52 hello all! 17:01:21 it's another week. and since I was sick last week, it's my first tor dev / network team meeting of the month! 17:01:35 as usual, checkins, then discussion. :) 17:01:55 nickm: glad you're feeling better! 17:01:59 hi 17:02:18 I'm on vacation next week. I'll be checking email approx every day or two, and maybe opening emacs if I get bored, but I won't do much more. :) 17:02:32 I got stable out last week; aiming for 029-alpha today. 17:02:51 I did a couple of branches that are infrastructure for other stuff we need to do; I hope I can do 15055 progress. 17:03:14 #item later we need to talk about what tasks we want to seek 2017 funding for. (Isabela sent some folks an email) 17:03:29 #15055 17:03:55 #item By the end of this meeting I want everybody (including me) to have a good set of august tasks tagged in trac. 17:04:18 #item we should get asn's guard task breakdown turned into tickets! 17:04:34 #item we should talk about isabela kicking stuff out of 028 to get it down to size. 17:04:43 and finally ... 17:05:01 #item I want to talk later about an idea I had to improve my ability to program, which has been somewhat limited recently. 17:05:07 that's all for me! 17:05:08 (029) 17:05:13 yes, 029 17:05:16 who's next? 17:05:48 * isabela can go 17:05:54 * athena can go next 17:06:13 athena: go ahead! :) 17:07:41 status: concentration pretty blown this past week by last weekend's incident, unfortunately - still tying off #19552 plus doing revisions for #18640 and #8625 17:09:05 #item we should talk about S vs U and picking tasks this month. 17:09:20 athena: those both looked pretty close to done to me. what's your eta for the revisions? 17:09:54 #8625 is easy; #18640 wants a smarter heuristic 17:10:41 I'm okay if we make it off-by-default by now, and have another ticket for doing the smarter heuristic 17:10:59 okay, i'd be happy with that too 17:11:22 got time at the end of this meeting to pick out tickets for the rest of august? 17:11:27 sure 17:12:15 great 17:12:35 hello. sorry for being late. was eating dinner. 17:12:43 athena: if you want to start looking over the list of guard tasks that asn made, that might be a good place 17:12:46 asn: hi hi 17:12:49 who wants to go next? 17:12:50 isabela: ? 17:12:56 working on many deadlines, reports deadlines, proposals deadlines -- while trying to balance it with my personal deadlines to be moving this month 17:13:20 athena: nickm means this implementation plan: https://lists.torproject.org/pipermail/tor-dev/2016-July/011234.html 17:13:21 sent an email to collect ideas for things we can put on grant proposals 17:13:26 hope everyone helps on that this week 17:13:38 I added a bunch, but if it's only me, it will suck. 17:13:41 and like nickm said, I plan on doing a big clean up on 029 too 17:13:50 isabela: i've been slowly working on the area of mobile improvements for the past 2 months. will respond to your email. 17:13:57 will tag everything i move out so people can track and review it 17:14:07 asn: cool! 17:14:08 isabela: (specifically #16387 is the parent ticket) 17:14:27 that's it for me for this week 17:14:43 i am also living off very few things that are not in a box :D 17:14:45 hehe 17:16:22 ok, who's next? 17:16:35 During past week I worked on implementing ESTABLISH_INTRO for prop224. The 17:16:35 patch is getting there, but needs more time. I also reviewed the RSOS ticket 17:16:35 and #19024. I also did more work on #16387 and talked some more with people who 17:16:35 want to integrate Namecoin with Tor. On the topic of Namecoin, there are 3 17:16:35 greek university students that want to work on this. I tried to persuade them 17:16:37 to make an addon for Firefox to integrate namecoin, instead of hacking 17:16:40 little-t-tor (for deployability reasons). That's it for me. 17:16:43 i guess it was me! 17:18:52 asn: I asked you a question in the backlog about whether the HT_ and HANDLE_ solution I was recommending made sense. If not you should ask me questions later on. :) 17:18:54 * dgoulet can go next 17:18:57 woo 17:19:04 during the past week, i did basic hardware stuff and setup for a bridgeauth server for #19690, wrote my reports for the past several months and for pets, and spent the remaining time working on my OTF deliverables on bridgedb 17:19:12 * dgoulet lets isis go 17:19:26 i'm done, sorry for interrupting 17:19:30 mad lag here 17:19:47 Since my return from the SponsorR meeting in July last week, I've been working on #18571 and #19024. That last refactoring has been reviewed and I consider it "final" for now. It will be added to the main branch of #17238. 17:19:56 As for #18571, it's done except a part for the cross certification for which I need #15055 stuff. I'm working on unit test and then will move the commits to the main #17238 branch. Last pieces will be #18572 which is also almost finished. 17:20:00 With some luck, we have a final #17238 branch in needs review by Friday and thus a big piece of prop224. 17:20:05 making progress! 17:20:06 --- 17:20:27 nickm: I'll need a bit more help for the cross certification but we can talk about that later 17:21:04 nickm: haven't had time to read your reply on #19043 yet. will do so later and let you know if i need help. 17:21:16 ok 17:21:19 nickm: also noted the part about note_pk_op() being obsolete. will make ticket soon. 17:24:36 ok 17:24:39 Yawning: ping? 17:24:54 also, anyone else with a status update? 17:26:53 I helped arma track down an issue he had with libevent2 17:27:03 it was related to static linking 17:27:19 would appreciate a two-minute chat about where the bug is post-meeting 17:28:18 ack 17:28:59 hmnn. I hope Yawning is around. 17:29:10 But while we hang out, we can move to discussion time if there are no more updates? 17:29:48 one thing for me: I've noticed that I have a hard time doing programming tasks that take a day or more, because of my distraction levels. 17:30:23 I am thinking, starting maybe around september, of declaring that I have some fraction of "high-latency" days, where I don't check email or go on IRC more than twice. 17:30:32 anybody got other ideas of how best to make this kind of thing work? 17:31:25 i feel that's alright, if you think it's going to help your workflow 17:31:40 nickm: that sounds reasonable to me! 17:31:50 +1 17:32:07 i mean, you can always try it sneakily and see how it goes... 17:32:10 that sounds entirely sane 17:32:48 If I were you I wouldn't announce these days. 17:33:00 I'm also going to try timetracking for the nxt few weeks, to see if my suspicion tha tI get interrupted once every 1.5 hours is in fact true. :) 17:33:11 ok, next thing 17:33:21 * nickm tries to remember the next thing 17:33:28 what's highest on your priorities for us to talk about, isabela ? 17:34:05 i was reviewing your items 17:34:26 i guess is the heads up about me clening 029 17:34:50 like i said, i will remore things and mark them so people can review, my goal is to do it by wed eod 17:35:47 this will involve marking some fun things as do-later. We'll have to be mature. :) 17:35:59 yes 17:36:16 isabela: do you think it's okay if you link the what-do-we-seek-funding-for pad here? 17:36:23 or should I refer people to the network-team mail you sent? 17:36:32 good question 17:36:37 i dont really know :) 17:36:46 but the pad has more stuff on it ! 17:36:49 which is cool 17:37:18 this is a big topic; everybody who works on tor should really have a look 17:37:44 yes, this is the direction of our work in the next couple of years pretty much 17:37:51 this is something good to do as a step back, and ask "so if we could get funded to do (nearly) anything on tor, what would it be best for us to work on?" 17:37:59 so it's important to have good ideas 17:38:30 does any one has questions or suggestions on this front? 17:38:57 I think mikeperry had some good ideas, you should forward your email to him if he's not on the list 17:39:11 I plan to respond to the email today with some ideas btw 17:39:22 please use the pad? :) 17:39:32 yesss sorry the pad :) 17:39:43 yaaay 17:39:56 maybe after the meeting a bunch of folks can all look at the pad and add stuff together? 17:39:58 nickm: he is on the list but I will ping him just in case 17:40:10 ok cool. 17:40:19 so that's 17:40:30 #action nickm and athena make sure they have august tasks figured out after the meeting. 17:40:46 #action everybody looks at the stuff-to-seek-funding-for pad after the meeting 17:41:32 https://trac.torproject.org/projects/tor/query?status=!closed&keywords=~TorCoreTeam201608&group=owner -- that's august by owner, btw. I need to add more stuff for me... asn, dgoulet: you should put your august stuff there too! 17:41:36 is it a good idea to add funding for crypto improvements to the pad? 17:41:53 isis: currently we're brainstorming I think, so yes 17:41:59 nickm: ack 17:42:00 I think I already put some of my favorites there 17:42:31 isis: yes 17:43:26 which e-mail is this with the pad? 17:43:30 should i be marking the bridgedb tickets i'm working on as TorCoreTeam2016*? i've avoided doing this so far, but perhaps it would make it more clear when i might have extra time to do little-t tor stuff. 17:43:38 asn, athena: we should figure out how to turn your guard task breakdown into tickets, and what is the best set of guard stuff to do in the next couple of months? 17:43:45 athena: [network-team] [important] Collecting ideas we can propose for grants to core tor 17:44:44 asn's email was here: http://archives.seul.org/tor/dev/Jul-2016/msg00066.html 17:45:15 isis: yes please, this helps everyone knows what everyone is doing for the month 17:45:21 nickm: yeah, we should 17:47:27 athena: any idea how we can go about that? I think we need to assign guards a pretty high priority 17:49:06 isabela: nickm: ack on the TorCoreTeam201608 triaging. will try to do asap. although i still feel that what we are trying to do with trac keywords in this case, is a bit like swatting flies with a sledgehammer... 17:50:19 asn: I wonder if you're making it harder than you need to? 17:50:29 the idea is to just take what you're going to work on for the rest of the month and mark it. 17:50:32 10 minutes to tor browser meeting 17:50:51 and also need to remember to mark all the ephemeral tickets that are created _in_ the month. 17:50:59 that's a separate thing from what i'm asking 17:51:04 yes 17:51:12 hm ok 17:51:30 if you are or will work on a ticket in august put the tag there 17:51:33 that is all 17:51:33 ok i will do the july -> august migration then. 17:51:44 (and stop worrying about the keyword) 17:52:01 with all this bookkeeping stuff there's an eternal risk of saying "this is too hard to do perfectly". Just do the fast version IMO. :) 17:52:30 is hard like any habit formation :) 17:52:52 but this helps us know what ppl are doing, if they are overwhelmed, write reports to sponsors 17:53:11 it helps coordinate things within the team and with stakeholders 17:53:25 nickm: the implementation plan linked seems reasonable; i'll ticketize the first few pieces of it, i suppose 17:54:13 sounds good. 17:54:19 isabela: personally, i have not found it useful. there are no queries to get the interesting info i'm looking out of that keyword. 17:54:28 example of things i would like to know: 17:54:32 anything more today or should we move on to the post-meeting thing? 17:54:37 "how many points are assigned to me this month?" -- no query to get this. 17:54:50 "what tasks did I do last month?" -- the keyword does not help with this either 17:55:07 (since that requires markign ephemeral tickets as well, which _noone_ does) 17:55:22 yes trac isnt the best tool 17:55:23 "what tasks does dgoulet have for this month?" -- the keyword does not help here either 17:55:31 asn: I would love any help you can offer adding the appropriate "find things that aren't marked right" queries or advice or systems on the NetworkTeam wiki page? 17:55:32 unfortunally you would have to add up the points yourself 17:55:47 but if you do your name the month tag and check points to show up 17:55:49 you could make a script. :) 17:55:49 you would see them 17:56:22 we can also have the query for the keyword on wiki page organized by person 17:56:24 if its not yet 17:56:25 I'd love to see these queries on the wiki page, and/or a list of the desired queries. 17:56:28 we do. 17:56:35 but it only works if people enter data 17:56:40 but again 17:56:50 if everyone isnt doing it the info wont be there 17:56:56 it only makes sense if ppl are doing 17:57:19 i know trac is painful, i have to deal with it everytime i want to know those things 17:57:57 i specially try to know points people have assigned to themselves and other things that are painful to query 17:58:13 right... 17:58:19 that is why most times i get a big csv file and do it on my own which isnt optimal either 17:59:01 anyway, some thinking and devops time needs to go here, if we are serious about this project management system. 17:59:07 we're programmers; if we don't like something, we should automate. 17:59:15 i know i'm whining now, but actually i'm not the only doing it wrong, based on stats from previous months. 17:59:18 EOF. 17:59:29 asn: I am indeed serious about having a system here. 17:59:46 i agree there needs to be a system for dev time management. 17:59:52 asn: you are right, based on stats we are not doing it right 17:59:55 now it's torbrowser time! 17:59:58 #endmeeting