13:30:56 <nickm> #startmeeting
13:30:56 <MeetBot> Meeting started Wed Apr  1 13:30:56 2015 UTC.  The chair is nickm. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
13:30:56 <MeetBot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
13:30:57 <dgoulet> and I think we should mention somewhere why we don't close it righ away else in 6 months we are going to ask ourself why the hell we don't close it right away?
13:31:01 <nickm> hi all!  Who's here for the meeting today?
13:31:06 <nickm> dgoulet: yes comments are good
13:31:07 <Yawning> \o/
13:31:14 <dgoulet> hello meeting!
13:31:31 <isabela> oi
13:31:35 <nickm> io
13:31:48 <nickm> once more it is wednesday
13:31:51 <nickm> also it is a new month
13:32:07 <nickm> let's start with brief status updates, then talk about whatever we're talking about?
13:32:10 <nickm> I'll begin
13:32:44 <nickm> I've been scrambling to get end-of-month sponsor-S stuff done, and trying to pay attention to HS issues, and generally running in little circles.  I hope I can get things done more thoughtfully soon.
13:32:55 <asn> (hello)
13:33:10 <nickm> I got most of the sponsor S deliverables done to my satisfaction.  I have the remainder done to a reasonable standard, though I want to work on them a little more today if I can
13:33:13 <nickm> (hi asn)
13:33:16 <nickm> who will go next?
13:33:27 <Yawning> I'll go
13:33:40 <Yawning> I wrote a bunch of pt related tor patches
13:34:01 <Yawning> to try to clean up the termination detection
13:34:09 <Yawning> then HSes caught on fire
13:34:20 <Yawning> so I wrote some patches for that
13:34:36 <Yawning> also reviewed the "upload a HS descriptor through the control port" patch
13:34:51 <nickm> are  any of the patches from the review circle done-ish?
13:34:53 <Yawning> and unrelated, fixed torsocks so stuff that I use works
13:35:06 <dgoulet> nickm: yeah 2 of them
13:35:11 <Yawning> I belive dgoulet's and mine are ready for higher review
13:35:16 <dgoulet> nickm: #6411 and #14847
13:35:38 <nickm> ok
13:35:44 <Yawning> both of us were going to look at the ed key stuff, but both of us are  looking at this HS thing I think
13:35:47 <nickm> could you tag them with nickm-review ?
13:36:03 <asn> (posting https://gitweb.torproject.org/user/asn/tor.git/log/?h=bug15515_2 on #15515)
13:36:05 <Yawning> sure I'll tag mine
13:36:21 <dgoulet> nickm: sure
13:36:40 <Yawning> the pt stuff I did should be ready for review as well, but it's trivial and non-urgent
13:36:52 <nickm> cool
13:37:09 <nickm> looks like I'm going to be reading a bunch of code today :)
13:37:13 <Yawning> and I still need to document the "we keep stdin open" thing in the pt spec
13:38:05 <Yawning> next?
13:38:10 * dgoulet can go
13:38:10 <asn> hello
13:38:17 <asn> i mainly worked on sponsorr
13:38:24 <asn> and crowdfunding
13:38:37 <asn> but the past 2 days i've been fighting with #15463
13:38:42 <Yawning> (and then HSes caught on fire)
13:38:51 <asn> i have tried to summarize the situation on the ticket so far.
13:38:52 <dgoulet> yeah that one, team HS is on it! :D
13:38:59 <Yawning> (I suspect this ill be a trend)
13:39:11 <asn> i just submitted a patch for #15515 which might solve evrything but will probably solve nothing.
13:39:20 <asn> i'm hoping to discuss this issue today on the HS meeting?
13:39:29 <dgoulet> +1
13:39:30 <asn> and that's that. thanks :)
13:39:42 * dgoulet ready to do
13:39:43 <Yawning> it raises the bar required I think, but stuff like lolbotnets would still cause us issues
13:40:52 <Yawning> so what was dgoulet up to?
13:40:53 <dgoulet> SponsorR, mostly with HS descriptor timeline that brought "fixes/answers" for #13483 and #12500, the HS fire ^ , some review here and there, one "medium" on DonnchaC_ patch, that's about it
13:41:23 <Yawning> I think DonnchaC's patch is probably review ready
13:41:48 <Yawning> I could look over it again, but my reviewing portions of that isn't a good idea
13:41:53 <Yawning> anymore
13:42:07 <dgoulet> Yawning: it's in need_review yeah so it needs "acK"
13:42:21 <Yawning> because part of my initial review was provided in a "here is a diff" form
13:42:32 <Yawning> so someone not-me should ack it I think
13:42:49 <dgoulet> Yawning: on my list
13:42:54 <Yawning> <3
13:42:54 * armadev notices a tor meeting (so early!)
13:43:04 <dgoulet> armadev: used to be an hour earlier :P
13:43:20 <Yawning> is that all the peeps here for this?
13:43:34 <Yawning> (and shoul dwe go back to talking about how we need to fix our hs stuff mroe?)
13:43:35 <dgoulet> think so
13:43:58 <dgoulet> Yawning: should we keep the HS stuff for the hs meeting else we won't have anything to talk about :P
13:44:41 <dgoulet> oh forgot isabela that is silently observing us! :)
13:44:47 <Yawning> well, I think some of the hs stuff changes the priority on some of our 0.2.7.x stuff
13:44:56 <dgoulet> true
13:45:40 <nickm> it would be nice to finish 0.2.7 triage soon.  Has anybody besides me nominated tickets for deferral/inclusion on the spreadsheet?
13:45:49 <nickm> (does anybody else have an update?)
13:46:09 <dgoulet> oh ah! forgot about the triage nomination, damn :(
13:46:10 <Yawning> I looked at it and thought it was ok a week or so ago?
13:46:59 <nickm> ok.  so the idea is that there are two lists: sponsored and non-sponsored.  By default, everything *not* greyed out in the first list will happen, and nothing in the 2nd list will happen
13:47:20 <nickm> if there's something on the first list that's greyed out, or something on the second list, and you think it should happen, mark it as a nomination.
13:47:21 <Yawning> can we relink the sheet?
13:47:36 <nickm> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1H_kAcQQ-NpGpKWG9RlF3w-NhruKKE9EZJcRaXBQGVy8/edit#gid=499528971
13:47:40 <Yawning> <3
13:48:05 <nickm> If there's something that _is_ planned to happen, and you think we shouldn't give it so much priority, or we can trivially afford to defer it, mark it in red or yellow
13:48:14 <nickm> (mark by adding your initials or handle)
13:48:17 <nickm> makes sense?
13:48:41 <dgoulet> nickm: your "nm" in green for non gray stuff is basically "Nick wants that in 0.2.7" ?
13:48:48 <dgoulet> (asking because no legend for green :)
13:49:08 <nickm> yeah
13:49:29 <Yawning> how do we nominate gray stuff?
13:49:32 <nickm> add
13:49:43 <nickm> add your initials in green to the who-nominates column
13:49:54 <nickm> try to put more negative nominations than positive
13:50:45 <asn> "Count unique IPs in an anonymous way" we doing this? i thought that the paper we liked had certain flows.
13:51:08 <nickm> I don't agree.
13:51:13 <asn> ok then.
13:51:20 <asn> i have not read the paper, i just skimmed over the thread
13:51:22 <nickm> or at the very least, I don't believe the papers *I* liked had the same flaws....
13:51:25 <asn> ok
13:51:48 <nickm> Also IMO even if all the flaws are real, it's still an improvement on status quo ante
13:52:28 <nickm> oh, quick straw poll while we're all here... anybody think we shouldn't remove --digests?
13:52:29 <asn> unclear if we will be able to do "Raise our guard rotation period, if appropriate" in 0.2.7
13:52:39 <nickm> we should certainly work on it though, yes?
13:52:46 * armadev votes to ditch --digests
13:52:57 <asn> since it depends on whether we will fix the guard discovery attacks for hses.
13:53:02 <armadev> i find this spreadsheet complicated, alas
13:53:08 <asn> (#9001)
13:53:10 <armadev> i think it might be tor browser can't display it well
13:55:27 <asn> ah ok #9001 is also in the list. so i guess tha'ts fine.
13:56:04 <armadev> oh, while we have developers here. what do ya'll think of my ticket8766 branch? https://trac.torproject.org/projects/tor/ticket/8766#comment:5
13:57:02 <asn> haha "Rumors that hidden services have trouble scaling to 100 concurrent connections"
13:57:09 <dgoulet> :)
13:57:25 <armadev> asn: actually that ticket meant 100 connections open at the same time.
13:57:28 <dgoulet> FYI, my HS worked perfectly fine for that ^
13:57:29 <armadev> not 100 connection attempts at the same time.
13:57:36 <asn> yep
13:57:55 <nickm> armadev: I think it is probably not a complete solution?
13:58:03 <nickm> armadev: not sure whether it's secretly messing something up
13:58:08 <asn> nickm: tickets on the first group look reasonable for 0.2.7. in the sense that nothing SUPER BIG is in there, and they are all quite important.
13:58:09 <nickm> also there are more timers in any places in the code
13:58:10 <armadev> nickm: correct, but it did fix actual behavior for me.
13:58:18 <asn> nickm: unclear if we will be able to pull it off for august or september.
13:58:28 <armadev> nickm: so right now it would improve the lives of tails users
13:58:35 <nickm> armadev: see also #3199
13:58:41 <nickm> armadev: you can nominate it if you want?
13:58:57 <nickm> I just did on your behalf
13:59:10 <armadev> thanks
13:59:13 <Yawning> #13737 bing gray makes me really sad
13:59:23 <nickm> so nominate it
13:59:28 <nickm> that's what we're trying to do here
13:59:33 <dgoulet> Yawning: nominate!
13:59:34 <nickm> identify grey things that shouldn't be
13:59:45 <Yawning> did
13:59:50 <nickm> woo
13:59:53 <isabela> hehe
14:00:04 <nickm> remember to also find included things that shouldnt' be.
14:00:07 <dgoulet> 35%+ for HS is crypto in the profiling of the attack so I think the intro circuit in worker is a NOMINATE contender :)
14:00:29 <nickm> (if we nominate more stuff and don't make time to do it, we might as well not nominate it)
14:00:38 <Yawning> ^
14:00:43 <nickm> also remembver that the ENTIRE second group is defer-by-default
14:00:48 <dgoulet> asn: you added your name but no color, you want them out or in  or ?
14:00:49 <nickm> IIUC
14:00:55 <Yawning> it's in response to "oh hey, fmonty"
14:02:16 <asn> dgoulet: it was more like "asn can probably do this for 0.2.7". should I green it?
14:02:25 <nickm> "can" and "wants to"?
14:02:28 <nickm> if so please green it
14:02:29 <asn> yes
14:02:32 <nickm> and find other stuff to yellow/red :)
14:03:13 <Yawning> red = no, yellow = meh?
14:03:16 <nickm> A thought: What if I make an 0.2.7-reach milestone, where deferrable stuff  that we don't actually want to defer on goes?
14:03:41 <nickm> Yawning: red = "I say this is a waste of time and not worth doing."  yellow = "harmless to defer"
14:03:44 <nickm> imo
14:04:05 <Yawning> k
14:04:36 <asn> so "Implement Bridge Guards and other anti-enumeration defenses" which is greyd out and has nickm and yawning as nominator, means what?
14:05:05 <Yawning> I put my name there cuz I think it's important
14:05:16 <asn> but it's greyd out because it's not going to happen for 0.2.7?
14:05:39 <asn> isabela: ^?
14:05:40 <nickm> it means it won't happen unless we decide to do it
14:05:46 <asn> ok
14:05:49 <isabela> yes
14:06:05 <nickm> THe way that stuff got assigned grey was, if it had high estimated effort to priority ratio, it got greyed with no further consideration.
14:06:12 <nickm> but that's a rough thing
14:06:21 <armadev> nickm: realistically, there's a huge amount of stuff here already. any reach milestone will get skipped wholesale. but still maybe useful if it lets us part with things more amicably.
14:06:23 <nickm> so we're refining it
14:06:33 <nickm> armadev: i think psychologically yeah
14:06:51 <nickm> isabela: what do you think about an 0.2.7-reach milestone?
14:06:53 <armadev> "i'm not breaking up with you, i'm just putting you in the -reach component"
14:07:43 <isabela> hmm
14:08:02 <isabela> ok,you mean we would have 0.2.7 and 0.2.7-reach?
14:08:09 <nickm> yeah
14:08:16 <isabela> I prefer not :)
14:08:19 <nickm> ok.  then no
14:08:38 <isabela> that is other ways we can organize these tickets so we know we once looked at them and considered them for 0.2.7
14:09:06 <isabela> I am also writing a proposal to reorg trac which will include to change how we are using milestones (but that is topic for another convo)
14:09:38 <nickm> ok
14:09:42 <isabela> After today I plan on reflecting this spreadsheet on trac
14:09:53 <nickm> woo
14:10:22 <isabela> and will make sure that things that were not in group1 gets tagged in a way we can recognize them
14:10:23 <asn> is andrea playing?
14:10:39 <nickm> I've pinged her; her sleep schedule may be messing with her again
14:10:59 <nickm> isabela: +1.  Do you know how to use trac's bulk-modification interface?  (And did we remember to give you access to it?)
14:11:04 <dgoulet> I'm relunctant on putting my name in green on non gray stuff.... I've already have much on my plate lol
14:11:10 <nickm> You shouldn't ahve to tag 100 tickets one by one.
14:11:11 <armadev> i hope i made isabela a trac goddess
14:11:13 <isabela> nickm: I am admi on trac :)
14:11:16 <armadev> yep
14:11:16 <nickm> lovely
14:11:17 <isabela> *admin
14:12:10 <isabela> <3 bulk modification
14:12:37 <isabela> !!! coffee is ready brb
14:14:19 <isabela> ok
14:14:47 <asn> i find it hard to commit to more non-obvious tasks.
14:14:57 <dgoulet> ^
14:15:04 <asn> especially with my exams coming up, it's hard to schedule for months ahead.
14:15:19 <nickm> this isn't so much "I promise I will do this", but instead "I believe this is important enough that we should do it."
14:15:30 <isabela> yes
14:15:39 <nickm> but of course if you can't imagine doing it yourself, maybe that is a factor
14:16:00 <dgoulet> oh ah! it's not a "takw ownership" but a vote that we must do it... ok I got it wrong then
14:16:06 <dgoulet> (for green)
14:16:08 <isabela> ok
14:16:11 <isabela> lots of yellow
14:16:39 <nickm> I wonder if we should look over all the yellow and see if we disagree about yellowing it
14:16:55 <isabela> yes
14:17:09 <isabela> that would be good - if ppl are done we could do that
14:17:26 <asn> ok
14:17:57 <isabela> I can start naming the rows (top-down) and you guys comment on it?
14:18:08 <dgoulet> go
14:18:10 <isabela> row 26 -> nickm
14:18:37 <nickm> worth doing IMO, but less important than other worker stuff.  I bet others do want it
14:18:46 <Yawning> probably ok, curve25519 is a bigger problem
14:18:47 <isabela> ok
14:19:01 <dgoulet> fine with me, I want it but can slip down a bit in priority
14:19:11 <nickm> +1 to what dgoulet said
14:19:14 <isabela> yeah that is what I would suggest
14:19:17 <Yawning> +1
14:19:24 <isabela> normal is ok?
14:19:44 <nickm> hm? yes
14:19:47 <dgoulet> yes
14:19:50 <isabela> cool
14:20:03 <isabela> row 39 -> dgoulet
14:20:10 <dgoulet> so since #15254 is off
14:20:18 <dgoulet> row 39 is a bit useless
14:20:30 <isabela> ok
14:20:34 <asn> i can also do row 38
14:20:44 <asn> in the sense that it's a bug i intorduced so it's easier for me to fix it.
14:20:59 <asn> here let me add my nick
14:21:03 <nickm> ok
14:21:17 <asn> iirc the fix was quite easy.
14:21:46 <isabela> asn: you just want to assign it to you right?
14:21:59 <asn> i guess so
14:22:22 <isabela> ok then I will remove the yellow name :) otherwise I will get confuse later
14:22:41 <isabela> ok dgoulet that is reasonable reason to remove it
14:22:45 <isabela> everyone cool with it?
14:22:56 <asn> yes
14:22:57 <armadev> we are about to freeze this list as-is?
14:23:12 <isabela> nickm: I removed your yellow from before as well, since we dicided on keeping it as lower priority
14:23:35 <dgoulet> isabela: yes we can un-gray it
14:23:44 <dgoulet> there
14:23:48 <isabela> armadev: is hard to ever freeze
14:23:53 <isabela> dgoulet: tx
14:24:03 <isabela> asn: row 41
14:24:38 <nickm> asn: Huh.  If you think that's not worthwhile, maybe we should consider it deferrable
14:24:56 <asn> nickm: which one, i'm sorry?
14:25:03 <asn> isabela: that's also bug on my code. can handle this.
14:25:08 <nickm> row 41 == #14957
14:25:10 <isabela> ok
14:25:13 <isabela> so stay
14:25:16 <asn> not very important.
14:25:19 <Yawning> maybe instead of rows, we use use #s
14:25:22 <nickm> #s
14:25:27 <nickm> would be better IMO if that's ok
14:25:27 <Yawning> so the bot pipes up
14:25:28 <isabela> sorry
14:25:36 <isabela> will do it
14:26:10 <asn> nickm:  idon't think it's very important. gonna take 1-2 days with testing i estimate. i can take something else, but eventually it will need to get fixed probably.
14:26:29 <armadev> i'm a big fan of #8782
14:26:43 <isabela> asn: i think we can keep it there
14:26:52 <asn> sure
14:27:18 <nickm> armadev: that one is slated for inclusion I believe.
14:27:18 <isabela> who is chupacabra?
14:27:52 <isabela> ok chupacabra please remove yellow 'asn' from that row :)
14:28:15 <Sebastian> I am removing the question marks from the stuff that says Sebastian?
14:28:28 <isabela> row 48 -> #15061
14:28:31 <isabela> nick
14:30:24 <nickm> I think that if the rest of the ed25519 stuff gets done and that slips, it will do no harm
14:30:49 <dgoulet> hrm once #12498 is merged for which we plan for 0.2.7, the controller using identity keys should follow else for a full version the controller will be out of sync with current possible keys?
14:31:12 <Yawning> dgoulet: our initial ed25519 stuff doesn't deprecate RSA
14:31:32 <dgoulet> it doesn't but controller should at least be able to tell that ed25519 keys exists (are) ?
14:32:13 <Yawning> we spit out the raw descriptor right?
14:32:22 <Yawning> isn't it the app code's problem at that point to do that?
14:32:30 <nickm> I agree that telling the controller is good.
14:32:36 <nickm> I only question whether it is _necessary_.
14:32:45 <nickm> If we defer that to 0.2.8 or later, nothing bad happens
14:33:04 <dgoulet> fair enough
14:33:18 <isabela> ok
14:33:29 <Yawning> (though if we do the ed key stuff right, it should be easy/nearly free to do)
14:34:16 <armadev> what does pink in row 183 mean?
14:34:30 <isabela> armadev: used to be red but is not anymore
14:34:31 <nickm> armadev: "was once rejected"
14:34:34 <armadev> ok
14:34:44 <isabela> ok
14:35:30 <isabela> I think row 48 is out from this release then
14:35:45 <Yawning> isn't it "move it to the next list"?
14:35:56 <Yawning> we aren't redding it right?
14:36:34 <armadev> #15235 seems like a useful doc thing. ln5 has a wiki page with some answers to it.
14:36:42 <isabela> Yawning: not sure what you mean
14:36:52 <qwk> Will the "vuln" since operation onymous be fixed so it will safe to host onion sites again? highlight me if you response ;)
14:36:53 <Yawning> when you say it's out
14:37:13 <qwk> Atm Im using i2p but its way to slow
14:37:24 <Yawning> hm nvm
14:37:34 <dgoulet> next?
14:37:39 <armadev> qwk: you're in the wrong channel.
14:37:44 <isabela> ok
14:38:00 <isabela> 49 -> #15062
14:38:02 <isabela> nickm
14:38:03 <qwk> armadev: can you recommend me the right channel ?
14:38:07 <Yawning> same thing
14:38:15 <isabela> ok
14:38:24 <armadev> qwk: #tor will be better for you.
14:38:29 <armadev> qwk: also see /topic
14:38:30 <qwk> thanks
14:38:41 <isabela> so is ok to move it to the other list?
14:39:02 <nickm> I think it's okay to call it a don't-have-to-do-yet
14:39:09 <isabela> ok
14:39:18 <isabela> row 51 #14881
14:39:47 <nickm> I don't get that one. how bad is it?
14:39:49 <dgoulet> rob's patch is a one liner
14:40:10 <nickm> does it require a revision of the spec or a new consensus method number?
14:40:26 <Yawning> no
14:40:29 <Yawning> I don't think so
14:40:38 <nickm> in that case, since there's a patch, we can leave it in
14:40:46 <nickm> (it's in needs_review, yeah?)
14:41:02 <Yawning> yeah
14:41:09 <isabela> ok
14:41:10 <Yawning> we can always defer it later if it ends up being scary
14:41:14 <nickm> great
14:41:42 <isabela> ok
14:41:51 <isabela> row 55 -> #13802
14:42:05 <isabela> sorry 56
14:42:06 <dgoulet> no issue at all to defer
14:42:15 <nickm> #13802 it would be a cool thing to do, but it woudl be just as cool in 6 months
14:42:16 <dgoulet> it's moving too much anyway right now
14:42:24 <isabela> argh (me got confused)
14:42:37 <isabela> ok
14:43:10 <isabela> is everyone ok with that?
14:43:16 <Yawning> mmhmm
14:43:19 <nickm> row 56 is #15017
14:43:39 <nickm> maybe a good idea, maybe not.  hard to say
14:43:53 <Yawning> I think, it might be interesting to look at, but there's more important perf stuff
14:44:00 <dgoulet> ^
14:44:07 <nickm> IMO deferrable, but not must-defer
14:44:12 <Yawning> ^
14:44:15 <dgoulet> I think it's a perf issue but can be defer
14:44:18 <dgoulet> ^ also
14:44:26 <nickm> but also messing with openssl stack stuff is usually harder than we expect
14:44:38 <Yawning> indeed
14:45:02 <Yawning> also afraid of 'oh go dopenssl does what?' leading to a rats nest
14:45:26 <isabela> cool
14:45:36 * nickm chuckles at "dopenssl".  It's openssl on dope :)
14:45:39 <dgoulet> I think asn got confused for the next one, I think he wanted to put is name on ;)
14:45:46 <isabela> yeah
14:45:57 <dgoulet> beacuse #8243 is I think an important one
14:46:02 <isabela> yes
14:46:04 <isabela> thanks dgoulet
14:46:12 <dgoulet> ah fixed! very nice :)
14:46:13 <asn> yeah basically
14:46:22 <isabela> row 100 #2149
14:46:27 <isabela> nickm and Yawning
14:46:42 <Yawning> defer, nice to have, but not critical, it's for magic annonymity boxes and stuff
14:46:55 <Yawning> the solution to that is to stop the tor process
14:47:00 <nickm> could be nice to have.  It would help the network some maybe, but I believ3e it promises to be hard.  I don't trust the patch we have for it.
14:47:19 <nickm> basically I think it should be "large" not "medium".
14:47:43 <isabela> ok
14:47:46 <isabela> will update
14:48:04 <Yawning> (also if it' sjust consensus downloads, we're merging the diff stuff which should help)
14:48:25 <armadev> ok, i have done a pass through the list. woo.
14:48:25 <isabela> ok
14:48:36 <isabela> anyone disagress?
14:48:44 <armadev> mostly i tried to leave stuff alone since if i get near stuff people will expect me to do things :)
14:48:56 <isabela> heheh
14:49:02 <isabela> pro tip :)
14:49:03 <isabela> alright
14:49:04 <asn> guys i will have to take a break. the day is ending and I have the HS meeting in an hour.  i only nominated #8864 because more HS ops are worrying about it, and I'd be interested in looking at it.
14:49:20 <isabela> asn: go for it
14:49:23 <nickm> +1
14:49:31 <Yawning> if you wanna do it, go for it imo
14:49:40 <dgoulet> +1
14:49:47 <armadev> sounds like a sponsorR thing too
14:50:00 <Yawning> ugh, wtb trac timeline fixed, but I'm too scared to poke at the db
14:51:05 <isabela> qq do we want to go over green?
14:51:06 * armadev tags #8864 with SponsorR
14:51:17 <nickm> we could
14:51:36 <nickm> 104-106 are all green, and all about faster curve25519/ntor, and all have (some kind of) patches
14:51:41 <dgoulet> ahha all "faster crypto" bug are assigned to Yawning :D
14:51:59 <Yawning> well, it'd either be nick or me I think
14:52:15 <dgoulet> no no it's fine, I can see where your interest is ;)
14:52:26 <Yawning> I'm not sure where our biggest bang for our buck will be re curve25519, I think cpuworker stuff might end up winning over these
14:52:35 <dgoulet> cpu worker also I think
14:52:44 <Yawning> but I'll know p fast if I poke at this stuff
14:52:59 <isabela> can we do a bulk ok for 104, 105, 106 and 108
14:53:00 <isabela> ?
14:53:13 <nickm> 108 is very different from the others,
14:53:16 <isabela> or do you want to go one by one?
14:53:17 <isabela> ok
14:53:19 <nickm> but I think we can bulk-ok 104,105,106
14:53:23 <Yawning> the other 3 are all the same
14:53:29 <Yawning> reasons yeah
14:53:36 <isabela> so bulk ok for those
14:53:52 <nickm> sure
14:54:00 <isabela> and how do people few about #7144
14:54:04 <isabela> row 108
14:54:21 <Yawning> we need that because it's an obvious attack
14:54:25 <Yawning> vs our good pts
14:54:30 <Yawning> and it breaks all of them
14:54:36 <isabela> :(
14:54:50 <Yawning> cept meek I guess
14:54:59 <nickm> it's hard though.  Do we have a design for it?
14:55:09 <Yawning> p 188?
14:55:21 <nickm> ah
14:55:26 <Yawning> I liked the design, but need to think about it more
14:55:58 <armadev> yawning: doesn't break all of them. good bridges are multi-homed.
14:56:09 <Yawning> >.<
14:56:16 <armadev> but yes, i like the design too. maybe a "decide about the design" step in between?
14:56:30 <Yawning> yeah I just don't think it's immediate defer
14:56:43 <Yawning> because despite the complexity, it needs to be done sooner rather than later
14:56:46 <nickm> ok
14:56:52 <nickm> I do want to call it can-defer though
14:56:59 <Yawning> yeah
14:57:05 <Yawning> next list is fine
14:57:31 <Yawning> till we find all our stuff mysteriously blocked, then it gets bumped up >.>
14:57:34 <nickm> onwards?
14:57:38 <nickm> +1
14:57:58 <isabela> so it should be red?
14:58:05 <Yawning> noooooo
14:58:08 <Yawning> D:
14:58:17 <Yawning> move it to the middle list
14:58:20 <Yawning> and ungrey it
14:58:23 <isabela> I mean
14:58:28 <isabela> yes
14:58:34 <isabela> that is what I meant :)
14:58:52 <isabela> I will remove the green names from there (gray out means to move it to the middle list)
14:59:21 <dgoulet> isabela: FYI, just added row 127, it's a new one and imo important short-term
14:59:30 <isabela> lets move to the next yellow one: row 114 -> #3199
14:59:34 <isabela> tx dgoulet
14:59:35 <dgoulet> and definitely could fit in a sponsor U or R
15:00:00 <Sebastian> (I have to leave for a while now. I went through the entire list, tho. Thanks for getting this organized!)
15:00:17 <Yawning> nickm: that's in needs_review is the patch bitrotted or something?
15:00:20 <isabela> Sebastian: np! take it easy
15:00:49 <nickm> patch is bitrotted and IMO the wrong approach
15:02:03 <Yawning> *looks at the explanation* oh wow
15:02:04 <Yawning> yeah
15:02:11 <isabela> cool
15:02:18 <blanu> I am here for the PT meeting.
15:02:25 <isabela> so lets keep it yellow
15:02:36 <Yawning> blanu: an hour early?
15:02:42 <Yawning> it's 1500 utc
15:02:45 <Yawning> :P
15:02:53 <Yawning> thought we did them at 1600
15:02:55 <dgoulet> Yawning: huh PT and HS meeting at same time?
15:03:02 <Yawning> yes
15:03:10 <Yawning> I brought that up yesterday and asn said "fuck"
15:03:13 <isabela> yes
15:03:14 <dgoulet> :(
15:03:17 <blanu> I have it on my calendar as 1600 UTC.
15:03:31 <blanu> So not sure why my calendar says it is now if now is 1500 UTC.
15:03:34 <isabela> dgoulet: i got confused because PT switched weeks after valencia
15:03:44 <Yawning> TZ=UTC date
15:03:45 <dgoulet> isabela: ah, shit happens :)
15:03:52 <Yawning> oh well
15:03:54 <isabela> i sent a note to the list
15:03:55 <Yawning> sorry
15:04:02 <isabela> hopefully today we can get a better day moving forward
15:04:16 <Yawning> I think the pt meeting time in general is awful for everyone, so isis wanted to reschedule it
15:04:35 <Yawning> (as in, only the europeans have PT meeting at a good time)
15:04:43 <Yawning> anyway
15:05:03 <isabela> Yawning: ah, I can help run a poll for that (just let me know the ppl that should vote)
15:05:04 <blanu> So what does this mean for the meeting today? It seems like two meetings at the same time on the same channel will not work well.
15:05:11 <Yawning> #3199 is probably deferable
15:05:12 <isabela> ok
15:05:18 <Yawning> blanu: we'll force them to move
15:05:25 <Yawning> we had the time slot first
15:05:35 <blanu> Okay I will be back in an hour then.
15:05:40 <isabela> what about the next row #10817
15:05:51 <isabela> deferable
15:06:08 <dgoulet> good to have, deferable
15:06:09 <Yawning> yeah, just a documentation thing
15:06:14 <isabela> ok
15:06:17 <Yawning> all the developers build their own
15:06:23 <isabela> alright!
15:06:40 <isabela> lets move to the next list
15:06:43 <isabela> or is ppl sick of this?
15:06:48 <isabela> :)
15:06:56 <Yawning> yes, but it's important
15:07:01 <Yawning> so we might as well finish
15:07:02 <isabela> thanks Yawning  :)
15:07:15 <Yawning> (imo)
15:07:34 <isabela> ok a bunch of greens right at the top
15:07:52 <isabela> #15087 -> should it be added to top list?
15:08:23 <dgoulet> sounds like it's U so yeah
15:08:54 <nickm> yes
15:08:58 <nickm> also it's very small
15:09:04 <isabela> ok
15:09:07 <isabela> sounds good
15:09:15 <isabela> next one #15220
15:09:28 <nickm> a bunch of folks want that and I already wrote the patch
15:09:37 <isabela> ahh nice
15:10:05 <isabela> oh we lost the ticket for row 132
15:10:42 * nickm searches for it
15:11:02 <nickm> #2555
15:11:24 <isabela> thanks
15:12:08 <isabela> sounds like an easy small thing for sponsorR
15:12:19 <armadev> 'ha'
15:12:23 <Yawning> "small"
15:12:40 <isabela> hehe it says small :)
15:13:09 <Yawning> think that was on our croudfunding idea list as well
15:13:49 <isabela> so we should move it to the top list right?
15:13:52 <isabela> all ok with it?
15:14:09 <Yawning> it's just th eproposal right?
15:14:14 <Yawning> not like "add it"
15:14:21 <isabela> I believe so
15:14:32 <isabela> nickm: ?
15:15:14 <nickm> fine with me
15:15:30 <isabela> ok
15:15:38 <isabela> next 133 #13339
15:15:51 <nickm> yes, really should do.
15:15:58 <Yawning> yes
15:16:00 <Yawning> dooooo
15:16:06 <isabela> hehe
15:16:07 <isabela> ok
15:16:14 <isabela> 134 #14165
15:16:34 <nickm> really should figure that out; we're in a bad way for forward-compatibility and future-proofing
15:16:38 <nickm> imo
15:17:15 <Yawning> ack
15:17:52 <isabela> ok I will keep on moving ppl ping if they disagree
15:18:00 <isabela> 134 #15228
15:18:06 <isabela> ops 135
15:18:39 <nickm> hm. could be good to do; but it feels loraxy to me.
15:19:37 <isabela> ok
15:19:48 <nickm> would improve load on dirauths though
15:20:29 <isabela> should we add it to the top list then?
15:20:43 <nickm> i ... think so?
15:20:48 <nickm> what  do others think?
15:20:53 <nickm> oh hey are we still in our meeting?
15:20:56 <nickm> we shouldn't be in meeting
15:20:58 <nickm> #endmeeting