14:02:15 <darkk> #startmeeting
14:02:15 <MeetBot> Meeting started Tue May 23 14:02:15 2017 UTC.  The chair is darkk. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
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14:02:37 <slacktopus> <agrabeli> Welcome everyone to the May OONI community meeting!
14:03:04 <slacktopus> <agrabeli> Seeing as we don't have a fixed agenda today (https://pad.riseup.net/p/ooni-community-meeting), is there any topic anyone would like to discuss? Or any questions?
14:03:16 <anadahz> hello everyone
14:06:40 <slacktopus> <agrabeli> As a note: We plan on publishing a new research report very soon (within the next few hours) on the state of internet censorship in Indonesia
14:06:56 <slacktopus> <agrabeli> This study was conducted by OONI in collaboration with Sinar Project
14:07:15 <slacktopus> <nuke> hi everyone
14:07:38 <slacktopus> <agrabeli> It will be published at https://ooni.torproject.org/post/indonesia-internet-censorship/. We will send out notifications on #ooni-talk and other mailing lists.
14:07:44 <slacktopus> <agrabeli> Hi @nuke
14:08:05 <slacktopus> <hellais> hello
14:08:07 <slacktopus> <sukarn> Congratulations, in advance!
14:08:23 <slacktopus> <sukarn> I'll spread the word where I can.
14:08:34 <slacktopus> <agrabeli> @sukarn thanks! Feedback for this report - and all other OONI reports - would be appreciated.
14:10:23 <slacktopus> <sukarn> I have a random question: Is there a way to use/view OONI Explorer with only data generated from the desktop or mobile app specifically?
14:11:28 <slacktopus> <agrabeli> @sukarn do you mean like to filter your own measurements?
14:11:41 <slacktopus> <agrabeli> instead of viewing everyone's measurements?
14:12:17 <slacktopus> <sukarn> I mean something like: - View measurements taken only on mobile devices - View measurements taken only on traditional OONI - View all measurements
14:12:50 <slacktopus> <agrabeli> Currently you can only view your individual measurements in your OONI web UI or mobile platform
14:13:01 <slacktopus> <agrabeli> While on OONI Explorer we expose all measurements collected from a country
14:13:10 <slacktopus> <agrabeli> You're pointing out a very important point!
14:13:58 <darkk> sukarn, what's the idea behind that filter? mobile device may measure landline (via wi-fi) and traditional OONI may measure mobile networks (e.g., using USB 3G modem)
14:14:05 <slacktopus> <hellais> @sukarn If I understand what you are saying correctly, you mean do search by “mobile” measurement or desktop measurements?
14:14:24 <slacktopus> <hellais> That filter is not currently exposed in explorer, but is actually fairly trivial to add (we already have a column in the DB for that)
14:14:44 <slacktopus> <hellais> It would probably just involve adding indexes for the software_name field and exposing a filter for it
14:15:23 <slacktopus> <sukarn> @hellais Yes, that's what I meant.
14:16:11 <slacktopus> <sukarn> @darkk You're right about that. I just had that random thought during this meeting, didn't find the option on the Explorer, so I asked about it. Context: Blanket internet shutdowns in India take place on mobile networks much more often than on landline networks.
14:16:34 <slacktopus> <hellais> https://github.com/TheTorProject/ooni-explorer/issues/109
14:16:49 <slacktopus> <sukarn> Your comment has made me second-guess that entire thought process, as we'd need information on whether the data was generated over WiFi or mobile network (2/3/4G)
14:17:16 <slacktopus> <sukarn> Thanks @hellais
14:18:48 <slacktopus> <agrabeli> Great, hopefully this ticket will be addressed soon.
14:19:01 <slacktopus> <agrabeli> @sukarn is there anything else you would like to discuss? :slightly_smiling_face:
14:19:28 <darkk> There are awesome routers providing wi-fi connectivity (e.g. for tables without GSM module) using 3G as upstream. I'm unsure if AS number is good feature to distinguish mobile network from landline, but ability to distinguish measurements from mobile networks is useful for sure.
14:19:39 <darkk> s/tables/tablets/
14:20:45 <slacktopus> <hellais> Also mobile phones can be connected to a wifi network
14:21:14 <slacktopus> <hellais> We are planning on adding in future versions of ooniprobe-mobile annotations saying if the measurement was run from wifi or 4g
14:21:20 <slacktopus> <sukarn> @agrabeli: Nope. Not at the moment, at least. This is the only thing I want to talk about, and it seems to be headed in a positive direction.
14:21:47 <slacktopus> <hellais> For the reason @darkk mentioned I guess it’s not going to be certain that if you are on wifi you are going to be connected to a landline, but at least if you see 4g you know that you are for sure on 4g
14:22:03 <slacktopus> <sukarn> True, true.
14:22:20 <slacktopus> <sukarn> And at least for detecting mobile-only incidents, that data would prove useful.
14:26:03 <slacktopus> <sukarn> We seem to be done with this topic. Anybody else got something on their mind?
14:27:33 <slacktopus> <agrabeli> I have nothing in particular to discuss at this moment. Anyone else?
14:28:43 <slacktopus> <sukarn> Alright, another random question for those in attendance. This one is totally unrelated to OONI, but since there's silence and we have technical people here: Does anyone know whether GSM towers have an IP address of their own?
14:28:52 <darkk> hellais: well... there are femtocells, so I'm unsure if 4G always means "air" in that case :)
14:29:24 <slacktopus> <sukarn> @darkk: Oh, yes, there's that too. I forgot about their existence.
14:29:47 <slacktopus> <hellais> @sukarn by IP address do you mean a publicly routed IP address?
14:30:11 <slacktopus> <sukarn> @hellais: Yes.
14:31:04 <slacktopus> <hellais> I think most of them don’t. They usually are behind some large NAT of sorts.
14:31:29 <slacktopus> <sukarn> Alright. That makes sense. Thanks.
14:31:49 <slacktopus> <hellais> It’s very carrier specific. I would be very surprised if there were any tower with a direct uplink.
14:32:02 <slacktopus> <hellais> Usually the will do a bunch of internal routing before you ever reach the internet
14:32:19 <slacktopus> <hellais> For example on Vodafone when I am roaming abroad I will actually VPN all the way back to Italy before I ever hit the internet
14:33:07 <slacktopus> <sukarn> I've been wondering whether its possible to ping mobile towers to keep a track of towers going down or being "switched off".
14:34:10 <slacktopus> <hellais> I think that even if you were to be able to that, hypothetically, it would still not be an indicator of the cell tower being able to route or not traffic of users
14:34:14 <darkk> AFAIK, TurkeyBlocks does alike for Turkish landline
14:34:47 <slacktopus> <sukarn> Thanks a lot guys! I've run out of random things to ask now.
14:34:52 <slacktopus> <hellais> http://www.caida.org/projects/ioda/ this project also does something similar in theory
14:35:02 <slacktopus> <hellais> but to be honest I am very skeptical of this type of approach
14:36:15 <slacktopus> <agrabeli> @sukarn not random at all -- we can include discussions in these meetings that are broader than OONI :slightly_smiling_face:
14:39:34 <slacktopus> <agrabeli> Any other questions? Thoughts?
14:39:53 <slacktopus> <sukarn> _and then there was silence_
14:39:58 <slacktopus> <agrabeli> haha
14:40:22 <slacktopus> <agrabeli> Well if there's nothing more to discuss today, we can end the meeting early
14:40:41 <slacktopus> <agrabeli> And hopefully we'll have more agenda topics to discuss next month :slightly_smiling_face:
14:41:06 <slacktopus> <sukarn> :+1:
14:41:12 <slacktopus> <agrabeli> @sukarn thanks so much for joining us today! :slightly_smiling_face:
14:41:40 <slacktopus> <sukarn> Once again, thanks for hosting a community meeting. It was a pleasure to be here today.
14:41:53 <slacktopus> <agrabeli> And please feel encouraged to ping us here with any other thoughts/questions/ideas anytime
14:42:02 <slacktopus> <sukarn> Will do!
14:42:24 <slacktopus> <agrabeli> Thanks everyone, hope you enjoy the rest of your day! :slightly_smiling_face:
14:43:03 <slacktopus> <sukarn> I hope the same for you all too! See you all next month!
14:43:30 <slacktopus> <agrabeli> :slightly_smiling_face:
14:45:52 <slacktopus> <hellais> @darkk #endmeeting?
14:46:15 <darkk> #endmeeting