14:00:12 <russdeffner> #startmeeting Activation Working Group October 12
14:00:12 <MeetBot> Meeting started Fri Oct 12 14:00:12 2018 UTC.  The chair is russdeffner. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
14:00:12 <MeetBot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
14:00:48 <hot_slack_bot> <blake_hot> If you use the iD editor, it lists local contacts if anyone local has provided that info to the github repo.
14:00:56 <russdeffner> Our typical format is to work through the items on the trello: https://trello.com/b/ogU4Wjd6/hot-activation-wg
14:01:24 <Blake> Hi
14:01:29 <russdeffner> Hi Blake
14:01:45 <nexofs> Hi
14:01:52 <russdeffner> Anyone here who wants to be 'known' (by the bot and counted) say hello
14:01:58 <russdeffner> Hi nexofs
14:02:50 <nexofs> hello
14:03:02 <russdeffner> oh and I'm forgetting my bot etiquette
14:03:18 <russdeffner> #link AWG Trello: https://trello.com/b/ogU4Wjd6/hot-activation-wg
14:03:45 <russdeffner> so, first item is always unfinished business...
14:03:52 <russdeffner> #topic Unfinished Business
14:04:07 <russdeffner> Take a look at the WG Essentials list
14:04:15 <russdeffner> In there are cards for...
14:04:59 <russdeffner> #link Previous Meetings: https://trello.com/c/aG8SlkdK/22-previous-meeting-summaries
14:05:46 <russdeffner> and actually the other card I was looking for is in the Next meeting agenda list...
14:05:51 <hot_slack_bot> <r_aytoun> Hello
14:05:59 <russdeffner> #link Unfinished Business: https://trello.com/c/b2h8Is4D/30-unfinished-business
14:06:27 <russdeffner> Hi Ralph
14:06:46 <russdeffner> As you can see in the previous meetings, it's been a month since the last one
14:08:08 <nexofs> how about today's meeting?
14:08:16 <russdeffner> and the 'actiony' stuff I haven't made much progress on
14:08:46 <russdeffner> For today, nexofs, the agenda is basically the list of cards
14:09:19 <nexofs> okay
14:09:38 <russdeffner> There are basically 2 'themes' from last time
14:09:58 <russdeffner> Submitting 'issues'/suggestions for TM improvements for validation
14:10:14 <russdeffner> And updating/enchancing the default TM instructions
14:10:40 <russdeffner> Ralph or Blake, did that go anywhere (yet)?
14:10:57 <Blake> Not really
14:11:17 <Blake> the default instructions are basically done and have been for a long time.
14:11:28 <Blake> They are semi translated
14:11:41 <hot_slack_bot> <r_aytoun> I have sent Nate a message asking if there is any way we can get Capture Dates for the imagery we are using so that we can include it in the imagery instructions. And have noted that there is a high need for realigning work to GPS for landslide situations as the existing features will be completely covered in some places.
14:11:51 <Blake> the only real problem with them is they were converted to wiki markup and they need to be markdown for the TM
14:12:23 <nexofs> I' m just following you coz i don't have much experience
14:12:24 <russdeffner> Yes, suggested was to add video/gif links, etc. so they are easily re-discoverable
14:12:28 <Blake> There is no automated way to get capture date for anything but Esri and DG Standard. There are no "real" capture dats for DG Premium
14:13:01 <Blake> and really only DG standard, ESRI does not make shapes available.
14:13:49 <russdeffner> It would be neat if there was a 'viewer' that compared them - even if Mapbox and DGP said 'unkown'
14:14:30 <Blake> I would ask Frederik to add it to osm compare if it is not already
14:14:31 <russdeffner> and nexofs - yes, glad to have you here; don't hesitate to ask questions, etc.
14:14:41 <hot_slack_bot> <r_aytoun> That puts us in an awkward position as to imagery instructions and would have to scan through the imagery to find changes that give an indication of newer data. But that would be patchy as the imagery is a whole lot of different capture imagery stitched together
14:15:23 <russdeffner> Yes, this gets further into the whole imagery coordination bit; should we make that a separate agenda item?
14:16:27 <russdeffner> ok, there is a separate card for that, so maybe in the meantime toss comments, etc. there...
14:16:49 <russdeffner> #link Imagery Coordination: https://trello.com/c/c4I8KFBP/75-imagery-coordination-improvement
14:17:08 <russdeffner> The one we wanted to discuss more was...
14:17:35 <russdeffner> #idea To add a 'I have read the instructions' button before mapping
14:18:07 <hot_slack_bot> <r_aytoun> I like this addition.
14:18:12 <russdeffner> this one makes me giggle a bit, because it's so true and comes from a great place...
14:18:26 <russdeffner> but, what percent do you think will read it?
14:18:40 <russdeffner> I mean, the instructions vs. just pushing the I read button
14:19:39 <russdeffner> I would think our effort might go better to installing/using MapRules (which I'll expand on in a sec...)
14:20:07 <russdeffner> And if a rule is violated it says "warning, you've done something outside the instructions; have you read them" :D
14:20:40 <hot_slack_bot> <r_aytoun> I think we will catch some of them when they are first attempting from home and more important some of those that are not being trained at a mapathon.
14:21:17 <russdeffner> Ok, we can defintely submit the idea
14:22:01 <russdeffner> And, fyi, we had a great brainstorming while in Jakarta regarding TM/mapper on-boarding experience
14:22:19 <russdeffner> So it's a good time to toss in ideas for improvement
14:22:23 <hot_slack_bot> <r_aytoun> Please share at some stage
14:22:53 <Blake> did you capture the results russ?
14:22:59 <russdeffner> Yes, that's more Nate and Tech Group - hear they are working on some sort of road map/blog post
14:23:11 <Blake> I am 100% against restricting what people can map at the moment.
14:23:19 <russdeffner> I was just there to through ideas
14:23:28 <Blake> I like map rules for the default instructions part
14:23:49 <Blake> and for paid mappers you can restrict what they map
14:23:57 <russdeffner> I see it as more like JOSM errors/warnings/etc - you can still save, but you probably shouldn't
14:24:10 <Blake> very useful. but it needs a lot of OSM community review before we restrict what the general public can map.
14:24:41 <Blake> Even discouraging mapping some things gets some of the OSM police in an uproar
14:24:45 <russdeffner> Yes, MapRules/this topic should be a separate agenda item
14:25:22 <russdeffner> So, let's quickly get through Unfinished Biz
14:26:16 <russdeffner> think the only thing we haven't touched on is large AOI's
14:27:51 <russdeffner> As I give a moment for folks to conclude thoughts on UB, getting stats from courses...
14:31:35 <russdeffner> ok, we'll keep rolling those items along...
14:31:55 <russdeffner> #topic Current Response Activities
14:32:23 <russdeffner> I think I will need a hand making sure we have a card for each response
14:34:07 <russdeffner> But unless there are any objections, let's call the Peru Friaje, Laos Dam Collapse and July Ebola concluded
14:34:49 <russdeffner> I think there so far back, it doesn't really make much sense to put effort into final stats, blogs, etc.
14:35:14 <russdeffner> and/or an after action review
14:35:38 <Blake> What about the current ebola mapping?
14:36:15 <Blake> Is that seperate? OSM-CD is basically taking care of it.
14:36:23 <russdeffner> Should we make that a separate thing or just convert the card to 'ebola mapping'
14:37:29 <russdeffner> I guess maybe Ralph knows best? Are you still tracking current projects on that card?
14:40:06 <russdeffner> Ok, while Ralph gives us the scoop on DRC; think the rest are still 'active'
14:40:09 <hot_slack_bot> <r_aytoun> At present 5265 is archived 5226 and5225 are 100%mapped. %225 is not completely validated 55%. 5260 was put back into draft at 19%mapped but Jorieke says we can republish if we have capacity
14:40:15 <russdeffner> What are we missing?
14:40:32 <russdeffner> Ok Ralph, thanks - will just re-title it
14:41:45 <russdeffner> Ukraine Explosion? - how is that going by the way?
14:42:03 <russdeffner> Uganda Floods/Lanslides?
14:42:25 <russdeffner> Hurricane Michael?
14:42:48 <Blake> Ichnyansky District - Explosion Area - 25% mapped,
14:43:25 <russdeffner> I haven't seen any size-ups for any of them; so that should be something that is a 'trigger'/moment of documentation for when we 'officially' got involved (or decided not to)
14:43:32 <hot_slack_bot> <r_aytoun> Uganda landslide is 90% mapped 37% validated.
14:44:47 <Blake> Size ups for explosion: Small area, limited time, local support ;)
14:45:07 <hot_slack_bot> <r_aytoun> With activations occurring on different Tasking managers it is getting increasingly more difficult knowing what is happening
14:45:10 <russdeffner> I guess in the case of our regional offices, we can just go by the time of notification
14:45:12 <Blake> I think uganda is about the same.
14:45:57 <Blake> It might be better, if you want to track what we do to have a spreadsheet
14:46:18 <Blake> Much easier to fill out a spreadsheet quickly than a formal email
14:46:18 <russdeffner> better than?
14:46:25 <Blake> formal size up to the awg
14:46:46 <hot_slack_bot> <r_aytoun> I have that in a .odt spreadsheet at the moment
14:46:58 <Blake> and it reduces the overhead for super tiny things like the explosion.
14:47:52 <russdeffner> I'm not sure I agree filling out spreadsheet or form is easier than email; but I'm game
14:48:19 <Blake> it is easier to see what happened at a glance for everything than sorting and going through emails as well
14:48:46 <russdeffner> Yes, but we need to email when a team is required or else vols aren't going to know they're needed
14:49:20 <Blake> yes, but at the same time, we do not need to email them when we do not need a team, like for these
14:49:43 <Blake> which the spreadsheet solves :)
14:50:20 <Blake> I would almost say that is the dividing line, do you need or anticipate a need for a team or help? mail the awg with notice
14:50:28 <russdeffner> maybe not, maybe comms folks would like it though; just saying - let's revisit the protocol and what should be done for different events
14:50:31 <Blake> otherwise, do it and record it on the sheet ;)
14:50:51 <Blake> well doing a size up for every little small even does not seem to be working, at least for me.
14:50:58 <Blake> event*
14:51:19 <russdeffner> yes, so let's revisit - for now, do we record these events at all?
14:51:27 <Blake> ya, we should
14:51:34 <russdeffner> great
14:51:43 <Blake> in a spreadsheet :), trello card is too much, google sheet
14:51:55 <russdeffner> wiki?
14:51:56 <Blake> also can't do stats on cards, but could in a sheet
14:51:58 <Blake> no
14:52:12 <Blake> might be a good place to collect other stats too
14:52:12 <russdeffner> do they ever get to the wiki?
14:52:22 <russdeffner> and not a page, just the list
14:52:24 <Blake> projects, contributors, etc for year end summary
14:52:39 <Blake> No, I would not wiki them
14:52:44 <russdeffner> which is only event name and if it's global or local lead
14:53:15 <Blake> No, I would not do a wiki page.
14:53:59 <russdeffner> The most comprehensive list of resonses I know of is...
14:54:02 <russdeffner> #link https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Humanitarian_OSM_Team#The_OSM_Tasking_Manager
14:54:32 <russdeffner> Should we not maintain that/move to a spreadsheet?
14:54:37 <Blake> that is pretty nice
14:54:40 <Blake> do you do that?
14:55:05 <russdeffner> I did not do all of that, but probably the majority of last several years
14:55:31 <Blake> I would keep maintaining that
14:55:46 <Blake> i mean, we could all keep maintaining that list in the wiki + the spreadsheet
14:56:08 <Blake> and call that good instead of a dedicated wiki page for each, even a tiny one
14:56:09 <russdeffner> yes, my overall point is without a 'central' size-up record - it's impossible to maintain
14:56:29 <Blake> I did not know about that list
14:56:35 <Blake> or I would add to it when I do the one offs
14:56:44 <russdeffner> and I'm much more likely to see an email
14:57:03 <Blake> Ya, or you see it in the slack channel
14:57:21 <Blake> because I do not think they happen without mentioning it in the disasters channel
14:57:23 <russdeffner> but in slack I'm often not sure who is leading
14:57:36 <Blake> well for one offs it doesn't really need a lead
14:57:46 <Blake> have to lighten up the overhead for one offs
14:57:52 <russdeffner> a 'full' size-up we are much less likely to misspeak
14:59:09 <russdeffner> ok, well we didn't get very far today
14:59:24 <russdeffner> I added the capacity stats to the card
14:59:44 <russdeffner> we'll leave MapRules/restricted editing to next time
15:00:08 <russdeffner> did anyone have a pressing new business to add or shall we conclude?
15:00:29 <Blake> NOt really
15:00:40 <hot_slack_bot> <r_aytoun> Not from me.
15:00:59 <Blake> but I have come to the conclusion that red invalidated tasks never get remapped through the regular process.
15:01:30 <russdeffner> Ok, we can keep chatting but going to end meeting...
15:01:31 <Blake> That color needs to change. Ralph your feedback and your colleagues. But I am thinking invalidated just goes back to 'clear'
15:01:36 <russdeffner> #commands
15:01:36 <MeetBot> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #rejected #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk
15:01:39 <Blake> well that is new business ;)
15:02:11 <Blake> But I agree, just wanted to get that to ralph for his thoughts
15:02:13 <russdeffner> #info DM Capacity and MapRules moved to next meeting
15:02:36 <russdeffner> #endmeeting