16:58:12 <pwaring> #startmeeting
16:58:12 <MeetBot> Meeting started Mon Aug  7 16:58:12 2023 UTC.  The chair is pwaring. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
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16:58:18 <pwaring> #topic Roll call
16:58:27 <pwaring> as always, announce your presence with your favoured greeting
16:58:51 <srud> Hi
16:59:00 <bhe[m]> Hi.
16:59:06 <tumbleweed> hi
16:59:15 <tumbleweed> looks like messages from the Debian Matrix bridge still aren't making it
16:59:17 <DLange> नमस्ते
16:59:26 <anupaannjoseph[m]> Hi
16:59:33 <efraim> tzag
16:59:49 <Guest7449> o/
16:59:53 <tumbleweed> nattie says hi by proxy
17:00:04 <carina> hi
17:01:02 <pwaring> #topic Finance
17:01:16 <pwaring> first part of finance is the second installment payment
17:01:21 <pwaring> for the venue
17:01:37 <srud> We received invoice
17:01:44 <srud> Will be sent to SPI..
17:02:00 <srud> Things are in process
17:02:20 <pwaring> ok, next is the deadline for sponsorship swag - do we need to say anything on that given that the deadline (5th August) has passed?
17:02:48 <srud> We have a couple of sponsors in the pipeline..
17:02:58 <anupaannjoseph[m]> We are still waiting from confirmation from a sponsor to finalize the design.
17:03:09 <srud> So we extended it to tomorrow EOD
17:03:10 <anupaannjoseph[m]> for*
17:04:36 <pwaring> final finance item is the import of said swag
17:06:47 <[pirate]praveen> 5th August was deadline to add logo to tishirts and bags
17:06:50 <kannan[m]1> hi
17:07:19 <[pirate]praveen> with Canonical they are still deciding how to send it
17:07:58 <pwaring> ok, shall we pick that one up next week then?
17:09:08 <[pirate]praveen> yes
17:09:36 <pwaring> #topic Registration
17:09:55 <tumbleweed> nattie says room assignments have started
17:10:34 <tumbleweed> we had a few people pay for food, who are staying at the hotel
17:10:39 <tumbleweed> (or thougth they were staying at the hotel)
17:10:54 <tumbleweed> so there's a round of payment refunds and re-invoicing going on
17:11:26 <tumbleweed> we probably need to do some more local registration approvals
17:11:40 <srud> I was about to ask that..
17:12:02 <tumbleweed> and it's soon time to bill people who didn't get bursaries, and cancel registrations for people who said they can't come without a bursary
17:12:07 <srud> What is our stand on registration only requests and those whose bursaries were denied
17:13:05 <tumbleweed> what do you mean?
17:13:17 <tumbleweed> what's the question, I mean
17:13:51 <srud> Should we accept all or accept only some
17:14:04 <srud> Since now we didn't reach the venue limit
17:14:23 <tumbleweed> I can think of a couple of strategies:
17:14:34 <tumbleweed> 1. first-come first served, up to the limit
17:14:42 <tumbleweed> 2. be selective until some point
17:15:50 <tumbleweed> does anyone have any opinions?
17:15:57 <tumbleweed> It's good to let people know as soon as possible
17:16:01 <pwaring> FCFS is easiest and quickest
17:16:06 <tumbleweed> yeah
17:16:16 <[pirate]praveen> I think we can keep it open till we hit the limit
17:16:16 <pwaring> and avoids any bias (or perception of biads)
17:16:36 <tumbleweed> how far away is our limit?
17:16:50 <[pirate]praveen> but some people who register may not turn up and people who come after the limit may lose
17:16:53 <utkarsh2102> no opinions from my side, everyone is welcomed from my POV
17:17:01 <srud> 300 was the limit we said earlier
17:17:35 <tumbleweed> [pirate]praveen: nothing we can really do about that
17:17:44 <tumbleweed> well, except asking for confirmation
17:17:53 <[pirate]praveen> give a bit more buffer from the higher limit I guess
17:18:09 <[pirate]praveen> assuming some won't turn up
17:18:12 <DLange> do we have enough rooms?
17:18:32 <tumbleweed> we're talking about attendance-only
17:18:32 <srud> DLange: we are talking about non bursary people
17:18:59 <DLange> I hope people ... will not confuse that
17:19:35 <[pirate]praveen> may be 20-30 as a buffer to account for posisble non show up of registered people
17:19:39 <tumbleweed> people are already confused :)
17:19:45 <DLange> yeah
17:20:23 <[pirate]praveen> we have 10% of room that we are planning to release from four points by 15th August
17:20:51 <tumbleweed> [pirate]praveen: you mean we're planning to reduce our rooms by 10%?
17:21:04 <srud> tumbleweed: yes..
17:21:05 <utkarsh2102> wooooooot! #FreeTheRooms
17:21:07 <DLange> how many is 90% that we keep, [pirate]praveen?
17:21:29 <srud> I'm also trying to negotiate if we can go below 90%
17:21:30 <tumbleweed> OK. I really want to see the room-assignment calculations before we do that
17:21:44 <srud> tumbleweed: will share with you
17:21:54 <srud> It is a complicated spreadsheet
17:22:16 <tumbleweed> yeah. I'm hoping for a real room-assinment one soon
17:22:26 <utkarsh2102> srud: please share w/ me, too
17:22:34 <srud> Yup..
17:22:41 <srud> I will share after meeting
17:22:45 <utkarsh2102> unless it's confidential
17:23:05 <pwaring> ok, shall we leave a decision on this until the spreadsheet has been looked at?
17:23:10 <utkarsh2102> lovely, many thanks!
17:23:27 <srud> another thing we need to do ASAP is send reconfirmation mails
17:23:38 <tumbleweed> OK, so we want to do reconfirmation
17:23:55 <tumbleweed> we need to sort out the current pending bursary things first
17:23:56 <utkarsh2102> about whether or not they're coming?
17:23:59 <srud> Because only then we can have (almost) final room assignments by Aug 15
17:24:10 <tumbleweed> reconfirmation can only really be done after the bursary acceptance is over
17:24:16 <srud> utkarsh2102: yes
17:24:32 <tumbleweed> two confirmations in progress at the same time is weird :P
17:24:51 <tumbleweed> actually I'm wrong
17:24:57 <tumbleweed> reconfirmation will only apply to non-bursary non-paid
17:25:02 <tumbleweed> yeah, we should do that ASAP
17:25:18 <utkarsh2102> why so?
17:25:29 <utkarsh2102> re-confirmation should also apply to bursary people
17:25:34 <tumbleweed> because people who have accepted a bursary have re-confirmed
17:25:40 <[pirate]praveen> if they accept bursary, we assume they confirmed coming, may be?
17:25:42 <utkarsh2102> plans change, things happen
17:25:49 <tumbleweed> the point of reconfirmation is that it's many months since they registered
17:25:55 <tumbleweed> bursaries only just happened
17:25:56 <utkarsh2102> are we relying on that?
17:26:00 <tumbleweed> relying on what?
17:26:13 <utkarsh2102> their acceptance of bursary
17:26:17 <tumbleweed> very muc hso
17:26:24 <tumbleweed> if people don't accept, you give it to the next person
17:26:34 <tumbleweed> that's why we have rounds of bursaries
17:26:41 <tumbleweed> is that not what you were doing?
17:26:46 <srud> I also agree with utkarsh2102 .. A second confirmation is worth it as this year it costs a considerable money
17:26:53 <tumbleweed> OK, that's a big change
17:27:23 <srud> We could send a mail saying to confirm the dates of their attendance
17:27:44 <tumbleweed> srud: I'm not understanding
17:27:47 <_rene_> also for those who said in the form "final, trip booked"?
17:27:49 <tumbleweed> they JUST reconfirmed
17:27:54 <tumbleweed> why do the yneed to do it again?
17:28:06 <_rene_> that one is basically reconfirm anyway since they actually booked the travel... ;)
17:28:13 <srud> tumbleweed: dates of their stay
17:28:14 <tumbleweed> _rene_: that's different
17:28:30 <srud> They agreed they want bursary.. But dates may change
17:28:34 <tumbleweed> OK, we have a mechanism for that, it's final dates (the thing _rene_ mentioned)
17:28:43 <utkarsh2102> quick q on that front: do we have a way to see who all didn't accept their bursary and their "accept_before" has passed?
17:28:46 <tumbleweed> we can email people who said their dates aren't final
17:28:55 <_rene_> that was my point, yes
17:28:57 <_rene_> :)
17:28:57 <tumbleweed> utkarsh2102: yeah, the CSV export
17:29:06 <srud> tumbleweed: OK.. That should work
17:29:21 <utkarsh2102> tumbleweed: okay, I'mma look
17:29:24 <tumbleweed> reconfirmation is a yes/no thing
17:29:32 <tumbleweed> we haven't done it in a few years
17:30:07 <utkarsh2102> https://debconf23.debconf.org/admin/bursary/bursary/?accommodation_status__exact=pending
17:30:09 <utkarsh2102> 29 people
17:30:11 <utkarsh2102> nice!
17:30:15 <[pirate]praveen> we should probably say only if dates are confirmed before 15th (13th to give us time to get final numbers) they get rooms or something?
17:30:20 <tumbleweed> utkarsh2102: that's simple, we cancel them
17:30:45 <tumbleweed> or you manually email them if you think they look like they are asleep
17:31:01 <utkarsh2102> [pirate]praveen: by 12th we should know, from bursaries POV at least
17:31:15 <tumbleweed> [pirate]praveen: I don't know if I can get this done in time to get confirmation sby the 13th
17:31:21 <utkarsh2102> we have people mailing about their missed deadline so I accept on their behalf
17:31:27 <tumbleweed> we usually need to give a week or so for people to reply
17:31:38 <tumbleweed> two weeks is ideal
17:31:52 <[pirate]praveen> but we have to give final numbers to hotel by Augst 15th
17:31:56 <tumbleweed> right
17:32:07 <tumbleweed> we're going to have to do some guesswork
17:32:10 <[pirate]praveen> or we pay 90% anyway
17:32:29 <tumbleweed> we can ask for reconfirmation, but some people won't see it
17:32:41 <tumbleweed> on the flip side, it may get some cancellations
17:32:59 <tumbleweed> so it can help, but I don't think we'll be at a point where we can cancel everyone who hasn't replied's rooms
17:33:56 <pwaring> what is our decision then?
17:34:08 <utkarsh2102> art of guestimation
17:34:17 <tumbleweed> I'll have a look at what it takes to do both reconfirmation and final dates
17:34:33 <tumbleweed> but I can't dedicate a day to this any time this week
17:34:53 <tumbleweed> it'll be an hour here and there
17:36:54 <pwaring> ok, shall we report back on this one next week, as I don't think we're going ot make a decision now? (and there are still a few items to go through)
17:37:04 <tumbleweed> we have to make it before next week by the sound of it
17:37:14 <tumbleweed> it'll happen outside the meetings, let's say
17:37:26 <pwaring> yeah sorry that's what I meant
17:37:33 <pwaring> make the decision and let us know next week :)
17:37:47 <srud> 👍
17:37:54 <pwaring> #topic Bursaries
17:38:07 <pwaring> is this the same item? it was added after the meeting was started I think
17:38:12 <utkarsh2102> \o
17:38:21 <utkarsh2102> we're done from bursaries POV!
17:38:30 <utkarsh2102> I sent a mail yesterday about it
17:38:36 <utkarsh2102> on debconf-discuss
17:38:49 <utkarsh2102> we've either accepted or denied everyone, no one's remaining
17:38:54 <pwaring> great
17:39:01 <DLange> great job utkarsh2102, thank you very much! And thank you very much to the diligent reviewers, you know who you are!
17:39:07 <utkarsh2102> there's bursary of about ~4000 USD still pending for people to accept
17:39:15 <tumbleweed> there are still one or two threads dangling at the moment
17:39:30 <utkarsh2102> 1000 * 3, 500 * 1, 250 * 1, 125 * 1
17:39:45 <tumbleweed> that's not bad
17:39:46 <utkarsh2102> DLange: yay and thank you! :D
17:40:00 <utkarsh2102> rest have either accepted it or denied it
17:40:02 <srud> 👏
17:40:05 <utkarsh2102> so we should be good!
17:40:15 <pwaring> ok, we can move on then
17:40:17 <[pirate]praveen> thanks utkarsh2102
17:40:27 <pwaring> #topic Visa
17:40:29 <utkarsh2102> \o/
17:40:45 <pwaring> security clearance, political clearance and extending the deadline
17:40:52 <[pirate]praveen> we have started the process to get political clearnace from MEA
17:41:35 <[pirate]praveen> we did not extedn the deadline, but there were some extra work required to apply - like finding a registered organization to send the request in a print- sign - scan format
17:41:48 <tumbleweed> silence from them so far?
17:41:51 <[pirate]praveen> 1-2 weeks we hope this will be cleared
17:42:17 <[pirate]praveen> they are replying withing 24 hours - asking for details about participants from some countries, that is good
17:42:31 <pwaring> sounds like this is all in hand then?
17:42:36 <utkarsh2102> that is very good
17:42:37 <[pirate]praveen> and Infoprak said they have printed the letters upto batch 3 (35 numbers)
17:42:37 <pwaring> is there anything specific we need to discuss/agree
17:42:57 <[pirate]praveen> looks good so far
17:43:06 <tumbleweed> excellent, glad to hear they're looking at it
17:43:26 <tumbleweed> hah, paper letters?
17:43:30 <[pirate]praveen> we hope to share the invite letters as soon as we have both the documents (from mea and from infopark)
17:43:52 <[pirate]praveen> yes, they are going to print and sign, we collect scan and send!
17:44:06 <tumbleweed> rofl
17:44:10 <pwaring> #topic Swag
17:44:12 <[pirate]praveen> they said digital signs are too much hassle for them
17:44:22 <tumbleweed> and a pure PDF workflow is too hard?
17:44:34 <pwaring> swag payments is the only item under swag, which I think we covered under finance, unless there's anything else
17:44:38 <[pirate]praveen> processwise signing on paper seems easier for them
17:45:30 <[pirate]praveen> we asked them if they can give at least scanned letters, but they said too much work
17:45:39 <tumbleweed> do we know when we need swag payments yet?
17:45:40 <[pirate]praveen> but at least we will have them soon
17:46:28 <anupaannjoseph[m]> Regarding swags, we need numbers.
17:46:45 <tumbleweed> you're not going to get perfectly accurate numbers
17:47:06 <tumbleweed> so it'll be an estimation based on the numbers from reconfirmation, I guess
17:47:29 <anupaannjoseph[m]> But since we are going lower than expected should we reduce from what we estimated before.
17:47:34 <anupaannjoseph[m]> ?
17:47:45 <tumbleweed> you mean because we haven't hit the venue limit, yet?
17:47:51 <anupaannjoseph[m]> Yes
17:47:53 <tumbleweed> Yeah, probably
17:48:00 <anupaannjoseph[m]> And some extra for sponsors.
17:48:01 <tumbleweed> unless you expect a big last minute rush
17:48:17 <DLange> You will not find people unhappy if they can get two T-Shirts or take one for a friend that could not join
17:48:46 <DLange> Compared to the venue cost, the T-Shirts are probably cheap and high perceived value
17:49:07 <[pirate]praveen> August 5: Last day to register with guaranteed swag. Registrations after this date are still possible, but swag is not guaranteed.
17:49:16 <[pirate]praveen> https://debconf23.debconf.org/schedule/important-dates/
17:49:28 <tumbleweed> [pirate]praveen: yeah
17:49:45 <tumbleweed> but we need to approve some registrations :)
17:50:47 <anupaannjoseph[m]> Ok, we will go with the initial estimation then.
17:51:38 <pwaring> ok that sounds like a good decision
17:51:47 <pwaring> let's move on to the video items
17:51:52 <pwaring> #topic Video team
17:51:52 <anupaannjoseph[m]> Once the order is placed, we will get an invoice.
17:51:59 <tumbleweed> anupaannjoseph[m]: ack
17:52:15 <tumbleweed> anupaannjoseph[m]: let us know when you're planning to place it
17:52:20 <anupaannjoseph[m]> And will hand that over to SPI or Debian France for payment/reimbursement.
17:52:21 <pwaring> as last time, local equipment hire and paying in advance for equipment
17:52:30 <tumbleweed> yeah
17:52:38 <tumbleweed> some more research has been going on on the SDI cable for the video team
17:52:42 <tumbleweed> otherwise nothing to report
17:52:51 <anupaannjoseph[m]> tumbleweed: As soon as the design is approved by sponsorship team.
17:53:04 <pwaring> #topic Progress on Haifa DebConf
17:53:14 <pwaring> carina / tzafrir: do you have anything to update us on this?
17:54:09 <tzafrir> There is an onoing site visit.
17:54:49 <pwaring> shall we leave this one then until the site visit is complete?
17:55:02 <tumbleweed> carina should have some good news to report
17:55:13 <tzafrir> We have met some people of the CS department and looked at rooms, and tomorrow there are some more meeting.
17:55:25 * tumbleweed has some photos of site visit so far: https://people.debian.org/~stefanor/dc24-haifa-photos/
17:56:09 <carina> hh..
17:57:02 <carina> another prof from CS agreed to endorse, but we are still waiting for final answer from CS, and from EE
17:57:16 <carina> *and pricing for the venue from EE
17:57:59 <tumbleweed> tzafrir also reached out to a potential local fiscal sponsor. They sent their handbook and discussions have started
17:59:37 <pwaring> great, sounds like it is coming along
17:59:59 <pwaring> #topic Meeting schedule
18:00:03 <tzafrir> If no more questions, I think think we'll move on.
18:00:07 <pwaring> Next meeting will be 14th August, 17:00 UTC as usual
18:00:09 <pwaring> #topic AOB
18:00:10 <pwaring> anything else?
18:00:35 <tumbleweed> just a wow that we managed this in an hour, a month before debconf
18:00:42 <tumbleweed> (I know we cheated and dumped the main topic, but still)
18:01:53 <pwaring> ok, thank you all for coming and see you next week!
18:01:56 <pwaring> #endmeeting