17:58:44 <nattie> #startmeeting 17:58:44 <MeetBot> Meeting started Mon Jul 20 17:58:44 2020 UTC. The chair is nattie. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 17:58:44 <MeetBot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic. 17:58:52 <nattie> agenda, as ever, is at https://deb.li/dc20meet 17:58:58 <nattie> #topic rollcall 17:58:59 <tumbleweed> o/ 17:59:03 <nattie> i guess i'm here 17:59:48 <nattie> MeetBot: pingall the meeting has started 17:59:48 <MeetBot> the meeting has started 17:59:48 <MeetBot> _rene_ adrianacc akhvar alexandra_ an3as_ ana andrewsh anisa apoikos azeem balu barbaradcf bgupta bremner calhariz carnil cate Clint cnote CountDracula[m] czchen darst DLange doko dondelelcaro esh_ fil foka formorer Ganneff gargantua_kerr[m] gaudenz gavinlai 17:59:48 <MeetBot> ginggs gregoa gwolf hacksk[m] highvoltage Hodgestar indiebio ivodd jcristau jeff3rson[m] joostvb juliank Kaare kanashiro Kannan[m] kaplanlior[m] KGB-1 KGB-2 Laney larjona lenharo lucas marga Maulkin MeetBot mjeanson moray msantana n0rman_ nattie nattiemh[m] 17:59:48 <MeetBot> nicoo nodens OdyX olasd PirateBady[m] PiratePraveen[m] pollo Q_ rajudev[m] Rhonda rmayorga rubund ruipb_ rul samueloph schultmc schultmc_ sgran siqueira srud taffit tamo taowa terceiro terceiro[m] tumbleweed tumblingweed tzafrir urbec utkarsh2102 valessio[m] 17:59:48 <MeetBot> valhalla wouter znoteer zobel zumbi 17:59:48 <MeetBot> the meeting has started 18:00:05 <highvoltage> (reading with one eye) 18:00:32 <DLange> o/ the other eys from highvoltage 18:00:44 <terceiro> hi 18:01:27 * nattie gives it a moment longer 18:01:52 <nattie> #topic last week's actions 18:02:01 <nattie> #info There were not actions assigned last week 18:02:06 <lenharo> i'm a little busy. i'll try to follow the meeting. 18:02:16 <nattie> #topic registration update 18:02:30 <nattie> registration is open and still ongoing 18:02:45 <DLange> how many registration do we have? 18:03:15 <terceiro> 263 18:03:19 <terceiro> #link https://debconf20.debconf.org/register/statistics/ 18:03:21 <DLange> nice! 18:03:51 <tumbleweed> 247 registered 18:04:25 <tumbleweed> (those statistics are still broken, but the MR to fix them has landed) 18:05:01 <nattie> onwards? 18:05:15 <DLange> yes please 18:05:17 <nattie> #topic content team 18:05:40 <nattie> any news? 18:06:56 <nattie> doesn't look like it - we can return at the end if necessary (if so, holler) 18:07:00 <terceiro> I'm planning to notify proponents today 18:07:10 <nattie> oh, cool! 18:07:20 <terceiro> (today is the deadline) 18:07:42 <nattie> #info Those with accepted submissions should be informed today 18:07:43 <marga> https://debconf20.debconf.org/talks/statistics/ says 71 submitted, 66 reviewed. 18:08:17 <nattie> #topic t-shirts 18:08:38 <nattie> we're getting there, have got a very likely-looking supplier, and are just awaiting their samples to arrive 18:08:56 <tumbleweed> so, we set next week as the date to place orders 18:09:02 <tumbleweed> I guess it's going to slip again? 18:09:04 <nattie> also waiting to hear from those who would like to do local printing/distribution effts 18:09:07 <nattie> yeah 18:09:28 <tumbleweed> do we extend the registration deadline for swag, then? 18:09:29 <nattie> hopefully not by too far 18:09:49 <nattie> not sure - that will depend on the people making the local efforts getting back to me 18:10:04 <tumbleweed> I think we should set a deadline, and not wait for all of the local efforts 18:10:13 <DLange> +1 18:10:13 <tumbleweed> i.e. we start moving on X 18:10:37 <tumbleweed> if you want to do a local effort later, before we order the global fallback, that's fine 18:10:46 <DLange> otherwise we'll be too late. We'd want at least some people to get their swag for the conference, not? 18:10:47 <nattie> personally, i'm fine with keeping the deadline as it is, but if anhone else has a strong opinion 18:11:39 <tumbleweed> so, what needs to happen before we can place orders? 18:11:42 <gregoa> (and there's also the shipping address question) 18:11:42 <tumbleweed> design 18:11:44 <tumbleweed> budget 18:11:56 <tumbleweed> supplier selection 18:12:00 <DLange> #info deadline so far is 26 July for guaranteed swag 18:12:19 <tumbleweed> gregoa: that will be added soon, and then we must prod people to fill it in, yes 18:12:31 <gregoa> cool 18:13:40 <nattie> re budget, it's likely to be more than previously projected, mostly because of shipping 18:13:54 <nattie> but i will come back with a figure for that before the next meeting 18:13:56 <tumbleweed> any idea what, yet? We need to get it approved before we can start spending 18:14:03 <tumbleweed> OK 18:14:12 <DLange> may be between meetings, too? 18:14:20 <nattie> DLange: i said before the next meeting 18:14:21 <DLange> I guess this does not have to wait a week 18:14:21 <tumbleweed> yeah, we should try to do that 18:14:25 <DLange> ok 18:14:33 <nattie> #topic budget 18:14:34 <tumbleweed> nattie: and the other things I raised? 18:14:50 <nattie> yes, i'll get those sorted as well 18:14:55 <tumbleweed> I mean, where are we? 18:15:03 <nattie> #undo 18:15:03 <MeetBot> Removing item from minutes: <MeetBot.items.Topic object at 0x14ef2d0> 18:15:11 * gwolf reads backlog and attempts to join meeting 18:15:27 <nattie> design already exists and has done for a while 18:15:35 <tumbleweed> link? 18:15:54 <nattie> https://salsa.debian.org/lenharo/drafts/-/tree/lenharo/DC20 18:16:04 <nattie> the Diversity, Normal and back SVGs there 18:16:19 <tumbleweed> can we get that into https://salsa.debian.org/debconf-team/public/data/dc20-online/-/tree/master/artwork ? 18:16:32 <nattie> i should probably solicit people's opinion on whether they prefer the monocoloured or colourful version 18:16:34 <tumbleweed> I mean the selected designs 18:16:38 <nattie> yes 18:16:50 <DLange> yikes, salsa is slow 18:16:54 <tumbleweed> OK, anything else that's blocking orders that we can help with? 18:17:03 <DLange> everybody is clicking these pngs/svgs I assume :) 18:17:05 <nattie> not at the moment 18:17:20 <tumbleweed> I guess mono vs colorful will also depend on printers 18:17:59 <DLange> what do you think your prefered supplier would take for production time and where would they ship from? 18:18:24 <nattie> one potential supplier ships from Spain (and has provided shipping quotes) 18:18:25 <gwolf> FWIW (few lines back), it'd be nice for people to get their swag before the conf starts - but I don't think it's __vital__ 18:18:39 <nattie> one of the fallback options ships from Latvia or the US 18:19:02 <DLange> o.k., thank you 18:19:25 <DLange> any indication of production time with them? 18:19:37 <DLange> Are they more in the "one week" or the "one month" camp? 18:19:52 <DLange> (my experience seem to only know these two types of T-Shirt printers) 18:20:30 <nattie> just looking through the mails i have to check if they've given a timescale 18:20:57 <nattie> they've been very good at updating by mail, though, so i expect them to be fairly quick 18:21:35 <nattie> i would expect them to be more in the matter of weeks, though 18:22:08 <DLange> o.k., so we seem to be getting later for receiving before the conference 18:22:24 <tumbleweed> yeah, I think it's fairly unlikely that most attendees would get before the conference, at this point 18:23:02 <DLange> then we should consider the valessio[m] option and just not do it? 18:23:09 <gwolf> There's a group belonging thing in wearing the DCn shirt at DCn... but if we don't make it, not all is lost 18:23:22 <tumbleweed> it's not impossible, but we'd have to select suppliers based on printing availability, and place orders ASAP 18:23:56 <DLange> ack, so (personal opinion) either speed up or don't do it 18:24:01 <gwolf> DLange: It seems too many people have invested lots of time in getting it... I also was of the opinion on not doing too much work to print+ship, but it seems to be very important for so many that I'd prefer trying to 18:24:17 <gwolf> if we deliver a bit late, they will still be the official DC20 shirts for our future 18:24:36 <DLange> right, but if it doesn't happen in time, I suggest self-printing as indiebio laid it out on the wiki 18:25:10 <DLange> again, purely personal opinion, shipping hundereds of T-Shirts around that people get a month after an event is not that ideal 18:26:00 <tumbleweed> but, this is a volunteer orga, the people doing the work get to decide when and how much time to devote 18:26:03 <nattie> people wishing to coordinate local efforts are very welcome to get in touch with the t-shirt team 18:26:18 <DLange> ^and that asap please :) 18:26:44 <gwolf> DLange: I don't consider it a failure in any way to get the shirt a week after the event 18:26:50 <gwolf> I consider out of our usual ways 18:27:01 <gwolf> but quite often I've got shirts at the final day of an activity... 18:27:01 <DLange> hehe 18:27:11 <gwolf> (and not just in .mx) 18:27:12 <nattie> can we move to budget? 18:27:34 <DLange> "it happens when it's ready" for releases and T-Shirts :) 18:27:55 <nattie> #topic budget 18:27:57 <tumbleweed> well, we do have a choice here 18:28:10 <nattie> #undo 18:28:10 <MeetBot> Removing item from minutes: <MeetBot.items.Topic object at 0x171b390> 18:28:10 <tumbleweed> we set the deadline for next week, based on printful's turnaround time 18:28:41 <tumbleweed> if we were to say we place an order with printful, next week, for everything that a local group hasn't taken on 18:28:54 <DLange> #link https://salsa.debian.org/lenharo/drafts/-/blob/lenharo/DC20/back.svg 18:28:55 <tumbleweed> then we can probably get a fair chunk of those to people on time 18:29:14 <DLange> "Annual Debian Conference" or "Debian Annual Conference"? 18:29:16 <tumbleweed> (printing in EU, so EU destinations, and probably north america too) 18:29:29 <highvoltage> DLange: hah I was about to ask the same thing 18:29:35 <DLange> the latter as on the design sounds odd to me, but I'm not a native speaker 18:29:40 <DLange> well, highvoltage is :D 18:29:52 <highvoltage> DLange: imho Annual Debian Conference explains better what the 'DebConf' expands to 18:29:55 <tumbleweed> but, nattie, I get the feeling I'm pushing you with a proposal like that? 18:30:07 <tumbleweed> you went rather quiet in the discussion of timeline 18:30:31 <highvoltage> DLange: what is highvoltage? 18:30:46 <nattie> i need to compare the products from printful and the other supplier i'm considering (whom i prefer) 18:30:59 <DLange> highvoltage: an native speaker of English 18:31:00 <nattie> but i think we can place orders next week 18:31:20 <highvoltage> DLange: ah, I'm not but I'll take that as a compliment 18:31:20 <DLange> highvoltage: a native (you see I'm not :)) 18:31:57 <tumbleweed> "The Annual Debian Development Conference" according to debconf.org 18:32:02 <gwolf> Conference. Yearly. Debian. 18:32:02 <DLange> highvoltage: pff, jy praat Engels asof jy in Oxford gebore is 18:32:15 <highvoltage> bwhahahahaha 18:32:32 <DLange> tumbleweed: we always say "Developers Conference" when we talk to sponsors 18:32:35 <tumbleweed> nattie: so, no need to fallback to that fallback. We're confident in other suppliers still making it in time? 18:32:43 <DLange> so .. probably that web page should be updated again 18:33:22 <nattie> tumbleweed: yes, and we will have substantially more information by the end of the week 18:34:10 <terceiro> let's just paint it white 18:34:23 <nattie> everyone can just bring their own then 18:34:27 <tumbleweed> maybe I'm not making my point clearly enough 18:34:43 <tumbleweed> we set the deadline for next week, as a fallback, in case we hadn't found options that we know are better 18:35:02 <tumbleweed> we don't seem to have confidence that we have that yet, because we don't have the information we need, yet 18:35:38 <nattie> right 18:35:40 <tumbleweed> if we want to guarantee EU shipping in time, we need to execute on that fallback early next week 18:35:50 <tumbleweed> (at least, according to our previous calculations) 18:36:20 <tumbleweed> are we prepared to do that? 18:36:39 <tumbleweed> it seems most of the prerequsities are there (and budget can be) 18:36:55 <tumbleweed> but the will isn't there, it's still not the preferred option 18:37:08 <tumbleweed> so, when do we decide? Monday? 18:37:17 <nattie> yes, Monday would be fine 18:38:07 <tumbleweed> do we know what placing a large order with them, would look like, yet? 18:38:14 <tumbleweed> I assume they'd need addresses up front 18:38:23 <nattie> i believe lenharo has some information on that 18:38:34 <nattie> TTBOMK we would supply them with sizes and addresses 18:38:39 <tumbleweed> OK 18:38:42 <terceiro> do we have to provide the shipping addresses upfront when ordering, or can that be provided later? 18:38:46 <tumbleweed> so, we need to collect addresses by early next week, too 18:38:59 <tumbleweed> we can probably start that process today 18:39:08 <tumbleweed> and email people asking them to fill them in 18:39:11 <terceiro> k 18:39:15 <gwolf> Shirt sizes are much more urgent than addresses, says my logic module... 18:39:30 <tumbleweed> gwolf: for a small supplier, yes 18:39:39 <tumbleweed> but I'd expect printful, for example, to be quite streamlined 18:39:51 <gwolf> right... 18:39:55 <tumbleweed> and they may block until all dependencies are met 18:40:13 <gwolf> my logic module seems to be a self-reinforcing neural network then ;-) It only speaks from past experience 18:40:50 <tumbleweed> nattie: shall we action wording an email for after the meeting today? 18:40:56 <tumbleweed> (and move on to budget...) 18:40:57 <nattie> yeah 18:41:16 <nattie> #action nattie et al to write a mail about shipping addresses for t-shirts 18:41:19 <nattie> #topic budget 18:41:27 <nattie> any news? 18:41:41 <tumbleweed> I think t-shirts are the core here :P 18:41:46 <tumbleweed> DLange: more sponsorship? 18:42:08 <DLange> none new ones, iirc 18:42:23 <DLange> anisa is not around tonight, I think 18:42:28 <nattie> I think Anisa mentioned that everything is up to date on git 18:42:40 <DLange> o.k., then no new ones :) 18:42:44 <nattie> yeah, she sent apologies just before the meeting 18:42:59 <nattie> #topic videoteam 18:43:20 <nattie> i believe there's a writeup from the sprint now 18:43:45 <nattie> #link https://veronneau.org/debconf-videoteam-sprint-report-debconf20home.html 18:43:45 <tumbleweed> #link https://veronneau.org/debconf-videoteam-sprint-report-debconf20home.html 18:43:49 <tumbleweed> ^5 18:43:52 <nattie> ^5 18:44:11 <tumbleweed> we were planning to test more of the vido stack this weekend, but it's still not all in place 18:44:41 <tumbleweed> hopefully the infra for accepting pre-recorded talks will be up next week, it's in progress 18:45:06 <tumbleweed> nothing more from me 18:45:33 <nattie> anyone else? 18:46:00 <nattie> #topic AoB 18:46:11 <nattie> next meeting, next week? 18:46:18 <DLange> +1 18:46:18 <terceiro> group picture 18:46:19 <nattie> same time, same channel? 18:46:27 <terceiro> what people think of aigars' proposal? 18:46:46 <urbec> do not like needing to register with gravatar 18:46:53 <DLange> Can't we just all mail him an image? 18:47:00 <DLange> like KISS principle? 18:47:28 <gwolf> I'll just send him a shell acount on my computer, and tell him to operate the webcam at his will :-] 18:47:41 <terceiro> I would't volunteer to collect 100s of pictures by hand 18:47:42 <tumbleweed> does anyone have a link for the proposal? 18:47:44 <DLange> nice idea, scales a bit badly, gwolf :) 18:48:00 <tumbleweed> ah: https://lists.debian.org/debconf-team/2020/07/msg00005.html 18:48:10 <highvoltage> I suggest adding the group photo to the schedule 18:48:24 <gwolf> DLange: Mailing a photo is quite bothering as well... We could add it to the Wafer profile? 18:48:31 <tzafrir> Will Jitsi be up to that? 18:48:34 <tumbleweed> urbec: the registration system uses libravator (which falls back to gravatar) you don't have to register with gravatar 18:48:37 * gwolf ducks before tumbleweed throws something 18:48:42 <nattie> i think there's an option for a photo in wafer 18:49:01 <DLange> gwolf: yeah, but development time is a precious resource, so ... mail / FTP / whatever is there and just works 18:49:08 <highvoltage> (oh I see nm my last statement) 18:49:17 <urbec> but still some external service, or did we clone that? 18:49:36 <urbec> people could commit pictures to a git repo 18:49:44 <tumbleweed> urbec: it's distributed 18:50:03 <tumbleweed> https://www.libravatar.org/ 18:50:14 <tumbleweed> but, setting up a libravatar instance seems way more complicated than emailing aigars a photo 18:50:37 <tzafrir> People may want to apear unidentified in the group photo? 18:50:52 <terceiro> we don't have to bikeshed on the details; maybe we could agree or disagree with the printiple 18:50:52 <gwolf> urbec: of course, maybe aigars stores his mail in GMail, so it'd be there anyway (-: 18:50:54 <tumbleweed> tzafrir: I think that's pretty normal, yes 18:50:55 <DLange> tzafrir: face masks are a think these days 18:50:56 <tzafrir> So email is just fine 18:51:01 <DLange> *thing 18:51:39 <nattie> wouldn't it make sense to ask Aigars whether he's willing to receive photos by mail? 18:51:45 <tumbleweed> yes 18:51:48 <urbec> oth git would be easier to collect them in the end than mail ;) 18:52:15 <tumbleweed> our experience says that our users reliably fail at using git-lfs 18:52:51 <urbec> non-lfs and delete the repo afterwards? 18:53:01 <gwolf> self-destructable repos? 18:53:06 <tumbleweed> yeah 18:53:12 <urbec> hehe 18:53:21 <terceiro> may I suggest we get one volunteer to hash out the details with aigars and come back to us? 18:53:24 <gwolf> A nextcloud instance for people to store everything they need during the conference and then destroy it in a fire? 18:53:45 <gwolf> terceiro: That's the best proposal IMO. The mechanics of the photo should be set by the photo engineer 18:53:46 * DLange takes a task to ask him for email receiving 18:53:46 <tumbleweed> terceiro: I'll reply to him 18:53:54 <DLange> or tumbleweed :) 18:54:07 <nattie> #action DLange to ask Aigars whether he's willing to receive photos by email for the group picture 18:54:12 <DLange> damn 18:54:24 <nattie> you offered first :) 18:54:55 <nattie> anything else? 18:56:19 <nattie> i'm going to take that as a no, so thank you everyone 18:56:22 <nattie> #endmeeting